https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/Enter Your Electronics & Design Project for a chance to win great prizes!en-USTelligent Community 12https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/203698Fri, 09 Dec 2022 13:55:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:652d9d0d-6e47-4315-8695-13c3750d0d48Jan CumpsHere a flow where both the industrial sensor and the piezo disk with michaelkellett 's front end are fed into a DAQ. To check if the phase difference was related to the DAQ, I switched both channels. It's not related to the DAQ. It's either caused by the front end (Michael's for the disk, inside the sensor housing for the industrial sensor). Or by the positions of the two sensors. The industrial one sits on top of the vibration hotspot. The Piezo disk a few centimetres away. Setup: And a statistical view, of the piezo disk with Michael's front end only: The acceleration calculation value isn't correct, because I haven't specified/calibrated the disk & front-end voltage vs acceleration. You can see that the FFT graph finds the correct resonance frequency at 40 Hz.https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/203693Fri, 09 Dec 2022 13:04:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:0dfd5c5d-3687-42bf-b041-14914082fdf7Jan CumpsI've been putting it to the test. Creating high energy peaks by dropping things right on the piezo. The circuit behaves well, containing the signal within the +- Vcc:https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/m/managed-videos/146958Thu, 08 Dec 2022 21:26:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:5c7a7dfb-87f1-48e8-98f3-9206c24ae7c5Jan CumpsVibration detection with piezo element. for blog post on element14: /challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/b/blog/posts/the-predictive-maintenance-taleopampvibrationhttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/203627Thu, 08 Dec 2022 21:25:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:78c12784-9fa8-44a4-b9a2-52b8edf817f3Jan CumpsBetter action video of michaelkellett 's charge amp/filter front end: https://youtu.be/hOXoEsePX1shttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/m/managed-videos/146700Wed, 21 Sep 2022 18:01:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:d73e39c3-922a-46f9-9040-1a517707fbb6Jan CumpsVertical Video Part of this element14 blog: /challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199871#199871opamppiezocharge amplifierhttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200676Wed, 21 Sep 2022 18:00:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:cd4bb272-fd52-4f71-bbaa-b08c30d8b0d8Jan CumpsAction video: www.youtube.com/.../_FsigN2DZkQhttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200675Wed, 21 Sep 2022 17:50:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:1697b28e-b3bc-4c3d-94a6-b176c8fb832cJan CumpsI've built michaelkellett 's circuit. I'm off on holidays. But I just had enough time to briefly test the circuit. Video is uploading...https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200606Sat, 17 Sep 2022 13:35:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:7596c57a-0205-4013-8307-b29eb9581741Jan CumpsThe PCBs arrived in Belgium. Total cost of OSHPark, including production and shipping from the US: 4.93 € Import fee from Belgian government: 19.16 €https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200234Fri, 02 Sep 2022 15:16:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:40f02e7e-283b-4002-b9a3-e74838a52303Jan CumpsThe goodies arrived (except the decoupling caps. I had them at home).https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200056Fri, 26 Aug 2022 08:48:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:0261e156-1632-4ab2-a2e0-fecd9b0132d9Jan CumpsBOM: Vendor Vendor # type qty package mf mf code description url farnell 3416403 C 1 1206 TDK CGA5F2C0G1H333J085AA SMD Multilayer Ceramic Capacitor, 0.033 µF, 50 V, 1206 [3216 Metric], ± 5%, C0G / NP0, CGA https://be.farnell.com/tdk/cga5f2c0g1h333j085aa/cap-aec-q200-0-033uf-50v-mlcc/dp/3416403?st=33nf%201206 farnell 1907339 C 2 1206 TDK C3216X7R2E104K160AA SMD Multilayer Ceramic Capacitor, 0.1 µF, 250 V, 1206 [3216 Metric], ± 10%, X7R, C https://be.farnell.com/tdk/c3216x7r2e104k160aa/cap-0-1-f-250v-10-x7r-1206/dp/1907339?st=c3216x7r2e104k160aa farnell 2918843 D 1 SOT-23 ROHM BAV99HMT116 Small Signal Diode, Dual Series, 80 V, 125 mA, 1.25 V, 4 ns, 4 A https://be.farnell.com/rohm/bav99hmt116/diode-small-signal-0-125a-80v/dp/2918843?st=bav99hm farnell 2447523 R 1 1206 MULTICOMP PRO MCWR12X4701FTL SMD Chip Resistor, 4.7 kohm, ± 1%, 250 mW, 1206 [3216 Metric], Thick Film, General Purpose https://be.farnell.com/multicomp/mcwr12x4701ftl/res-4k7-1-0-25w-1206-thick-film/dp/2447523?st=4k7%201206 farnell 2447478 R 1 1206 MULTICOMP PRO MCWR12X1004FTL SMD Chip Resistor, 1 Mohm, ± 1%, 250 mW, 1206 [3216 Metric], Thick Film, General Purpose https://be.farnell.com/multicomp/mcwr12x1004ftl/res-1m-1-0-25w-thick-film/dp/2447478?st=1m%20%201206 farnell 2849874 U 1 SOIC STMICROELECTRONICS TL071CDT Operational Amplifier, 1 Amplifier, 4 MHz, 16 V/µs, 6V to 36V, SOIC, 8 Pins https://be.farnell.com/stmicroelectronics/tl071cdt/so-08-15-jede-single-j-fet-op/dp/2849874?st=tl071 I selected components that are in stock, available on cut tape. Actual quantity ordered: 10, 50, 100, 100, 100, 5. Minimum is 10, 5, 5, 10, 10, 5. In that case the sum is approx. 8.5€ excl. VAT and shipping.https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200002Mon, 22 Aug 2022 14:43:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:3f4c9452-cbe6-411c-92eb-d765130488dascottiebabeAs MK notes in their recommendations for selecting the integration capacitor, MLCC can also exhibit the piezo-electric effect and become sensors too. So if your sensor board is really going to rattle around, it's something to consider. Although when I tried it now on my o-scope with a 10uF 16V, I didn't see much. Just food for thought.https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/200001Mon, 22 Aug 2022 13:28:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:e8fb1c61-0084-4f60-9526-10968d8ea334michaelkellettHere's a way of using a single supply. You need one big decoupling cap but its very hard to see any way round that. If you give the sensor a really big thump the voltage across C3 will chang so you need to pick the time constant of C3 and R3//R4 carefully. A better performance can be obtained with an active voltage divider but thats more parts. A really nice op amp for this would be the TI OPA375 but they are currently hard to get. The MCP601 suggested by /members/scottiebabe would work but isn't rail to rail input so is kind of near its limit with a 3.3V supply (OK with 5V). It is noisey but this probably won't matter too much. The NCV20166 from Onsemi looks good on paper and Farnell have stock (3528474). I've never used them. MKhttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199997Mon, 22 Aug 2022 08:32:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:6459b000-b877-4608-82ef-48f0a2cce5dcmichaelkellettAbsolutely fine re name. /members/scottiebabe makes a good suggestion re. single supply op amps. The tricky part is getting the biasing right. I'll give it some thought and post something later today if I can. MKhttps://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199988Sat, 20 Aug 2022 19:17:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:706627d2-c19e-4a29-885d-a393db8de463scottiebabeNice little TIA circuit! If you are going to make a PCB, you may want to try making a single-supply version too. There are lots of low-cost CMOS op-amps, ex: MCP601 nothing special about it all other than that you can still get them in DIP.https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199986Sat, 20 Aug 2022 16:26:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:474597d6-c942-4682-a51f-36cd9011f9cfJan Cumpsmichaelkellett , is it OK to have your name on schematic and pcb?https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199985Sat, 20 Aug 2022 14:31:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:26146e95-f237-47d0-9804-2f34bb10f457Jan CumpsKiCad schematic edit: the charge capacitor is to be adapted to the capacity of the piezo element (see Michael's post above, and his paper ). My element has 35 nF capacity. When I use a 33 nF value in the simulator, I get a response that's close to 0dB. With a 22 nF, it bops up to +4 dB 33 nF (match the input element) 22 nF:https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199974Fri, 19 Aug 2022 19:50:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:506beb11-1c1a-4780-89c7-0923929a9314Jan CumpsIn volts:https://community.element14.com/challenges-projects/project14/tales4makers/f/forum/51513/the-predictive-maintenance-tale---piezo-element-voltages/199973Fri, 19 Aug 2022 18:51:00 GMT93d5dcb4-84c2-446f-b2cb-99731719e767:68b38a23-b2ac-4cbc-b82b-148caa4cf602Jan CumpsSimulation results. I saw on your website that you used an LT071, so I downloaded the model from TI, and drew an opamp symbol for it. changes: BAV99HM are no longer advised for new designs, suppliers suggest HY variant. 35 nF capacity for the piezo It has been some time since I used LTSpice, the muscle memory was gone, but I got it working: