RASynBoard - Recent Threads

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:49:01 GMT

You can see the hardware arrangement I made for the experiment I did here. Later I switched to ESP32 dev kit to complete the experiment.

RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Fri, 12 Jan 2024 17:35:47 GMT

Long story short, I was road-testing the RAsynboard and I wanted to create an activity tracker using the IMU sensor present in it. Due to the delicate nature of the board (two tiny jumpers wires on core board already started peeling away), I made sure I handled it with proper care. I strapped the board powered by a small 3.7v battery to my arm to collect data in SD card to create ML model. I am not sure, but I think due to sweat the board got shorted somewhere and stopped working. It blinks in red color for a few milli second and stops. I used prebuilt binaries for generating raw sensor values, nothing fancy. Now I can't even program it further (Created new project configuration in Renesas Programmer as well as suggested in guide).

Since there is a dedicated forum for RAsynboard, I have decided to ask for help here. Any suggestions will be helpful. I am will gladly provide additional details if needed for clarification.

[View:/cfs-file/__key/communityserver-discussions-components-files/399/Rasynboard-Issue.mp4:640:360]

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:46:46 GMT

Although, I am not sure about PCB damage due to those jumpers. Because, as I have already said I was able to use it even after those pins were torn off.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:45:32 GMT

No, I can't reprogram or debug the board using IO board either.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

peterfenn — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:42:01 GMT

The last thing to possibly try here, is to reboot your PC, then re-attach the USB cable between core board and the PC... but I doubt this is an issue with your USB driver. It increasingly sounds like the PCB damage has resulted in permanent damage to the MCU.
Are you still able to reprogram and debug via the IO Board (ie. with both jumpers removed)

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:34:37 GMT

USB cable is working fine. I can transfer data with other dev kits. Renesas Flash Programmer is installed as well. Debugger unit is showing up in device manager.

I am not really good at hardware debugging, will glad follow any instructions provided to fix the board.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

peterfenn — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:30:15 GMT

At this stage I suspect that something is unresolved from the PCB jumper damage and/or the relevant MCU IOs may have sustained some damage...

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

peterfenn — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:25:47 GMT

Make sure the USB-C cable includes data interface (ie. not just a charging cable)
Make sure you have installed the Renesas Flash Programmer on your development PC

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 14:11:09 GMT

No, the COM port did not appear at all. I have tested with another laptop as well.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

peterfenn — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 13:23:19 GMT

With the jumper in place on J5 of Core board, do you hear/see the interface enumerate when you connect USB cable from Core board to your PC?

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 10:02:41 GMT

Hi, I have soldered the J5 and connected the jumpers, took core board out of IO board. Powered the core board using external supply. Green LED indication is working, but the core board is not working. Is there anything else I can do?

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Thu, 18 Jan 2024 10:00:55 GMT

Hi, I tried Peter's suggestion and soldered the J5 connectors.

1. Yes, I have detached the core board and powered via USB-C cable, green LED is ON. But the board is not working.

2. No, there was no debug messages from the COM port.

3. No, COM port did not appear in device manager at all.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Sat, 13 Jan 2024 04:39:30 GMT

I mostly followed the test plan provided in the OOB repo along with the tutorials made by you on Hackster, which honestly was very helpful to start developing application. I flashed the models to memory only one time and the core board was working well separately then. Considering how brittle the connectors between IO board and core board, I never separated the boards again.

1. Debugger Unit is showing up in device manager.

2. I have flashed the OOB application, with "BLE_Enabled=1" & "button_shift=imu" enabled in config

3. Usually I enable the write to option in config file and a drive will appear in windows file manager when connected via USB cable. But it is not appearing now, and I don't see any data coming from USB port either.

Considering Peter's suggestion below and yours, I will try to run the core board as a standalone module by resoldering the J5 jumper and check whether it is working.

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

balajivan1995 — Sat, 13 Jan 2024 04:25:38 GMT

Yes, the J5 connector was broken when I tried to strap the kit to my arm, the thin wire was actually peeling off from the solder pad. J5 connector needs to be bridged when the core board alone needs to be working. When connected with IO board, J5 jumper should be disconnected. Since I was experimenting with config files in SD card mostly, I kept IO board and core board paired always. It was working fine without the J5 jumper bridged. To avoid J5 connector wires shorting with other components I removed them from the pad.

I think you could be right, when I removed the pins from the pad, I should have coated the exposed area with insulating material. Currently I am out of town, and I don't have the kit with me. I will resolder the J5 jumper and try to run the application without IO board. Hopefully I could verify the integrity of core board..

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

peterfenn — Fri, 12 Jan 2024 18:08:02 GMT

From the video plus your comments it appears that the small (1.27mm pitch) SMT 2-pin header (J5) on the core board has broken-off? This damage to the PCB has likely compromised the integrity of the Boot-Selection circuit which relies on tiny R17 and R48 resistors

RE: RAsynboard stopped working

bwilless — Fri, 12 Jan 2024 18:05:12 GMT

Sorry to hear that your board is not working. I've not seen this issue before.

Does your PC recognize the Renesas Debugger hardware if your remove the J3 jumper and connect your USB-C cable to the I/O board?

Does the core board operate when separated from the I/O board? If you have an application loaded and you had flashed the models to the SPI Flash (user button > 3 seconds), the small LED between the battery connector and the USB-C connector will double flash if the application detects an inference event from the NDP120.

Detach the I/O board and power the core board using the USB-C connector on the core board
Do you see any debug from the COM port associated with the connection?
Maybe a better question is does the COM port associated with the USB-C connector on the core board enumerate on your PC?

Brian

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

bwilless — Mon, 20 Nov 2023 20:35:06 GMT

Hi mon2,

My name is Brian and I'm one of the developers supporting the Avnet RASynBoard. I'm just back from PTO and can offer assistance in this thread.

You asked about the AAD TDK feature. This is not currently supported; I would have to look into what it would take to enable this feature as the microphone is managed by the NDP120 firmware. I'll open a dialog with Syntiant to see what's possible.

Regarding the two microphone performance. We currently have an older RASynBoard image that works with the alexa model that's showcased in the video link you provided.

We're currently updating the RASynBoard firmware to support the latest Syntiant SDK and along with that work I've requested single and dual-mic Alexa models that can run on the RASynBoard. I think this is still 2-3 weeks away from a public release. I'll be sure an update this thread once it's been releases.

RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

mon2 — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 21:32:28 GMT

Hi. Just placed an order for this new board. Are schematics available for this tool? The option file (on sd card) permits use of a dual mic configuration, which additional microphone can be attached? What is the pinout to the NDP120 for use of this 2nd microphone? Wish to test far field audio pickup with background noise cancellation for the kws testing. Are the DSP packages available for the 2 microphone with far field support? Looks like a great tool and excited to have found it. Thanks.

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

mon2 — Thu, 09 Nov 2023 13:19:54 GMT

Excellent advice. Is the DSP binary available from Avnet or Syntiant to allow us to test with_aec feature? The impressive youtube demos is what we wish to replicate using 2 x microphones. We will remain with the referenced TDK microphones and will also consider to source the TDK EVB that offers support of 2 x flex microphones that will demonstrate the quality of the audio pickup over USB and audacity. Will request the same DSP files on their user forum but the factory support has been quite weak on past questions.

Does the RASynBoard make use of the AAD feature in the TDK microphone (wake on audio thresholds) to allow for further sleep mode current savings? Based on the paddle board pinout, perhaps not? If yes, which GPIO pin is monitoring for this IRQ event?

The results we wish to replicate:

www.youtube.com/watch

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

peterfenn — Thu, 09 Nov 2023 00:39:04 GMT

Anecdotal feedback from Syntiant was that the TDK T5838 microphone is significantly (~4x) more sensitive than the Infineon IM69D130 microphone on their NDP9120 EVB board

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

peterfenn — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 23:28:20 GMT

1) Are the PDM microphones specific to the applied firmware?
Can we switch out the TDK MMICT5832 with perhaps the IM67D130AXTSA2 (Infineon)?
Having a mix of different mics is not recommended, as the TDK and Infineon mics have different characteristics

2) Would the microphone on the aux shown paddleboard be the same as the primary TDK microphone?
>> Yes, an identical TDK MMICT5832 part# is used for the second microphone

3) Are the DSP files user created or supplied by Syntiant?
>> Yes, Syntiant provide a DSP files for single mic and dual mic use cases
The relevant DSP .synpkg binaries can be accessed within the ndp120/synpkg_files folder, of the out-of-box application
https://github.com/Avnet/RASynBoard-Out-of-Box-Demo/tree/rasynboard_v2_tiny/ndp120/synpkg_files

PS: Dual mic operation can be selected without rebuilding the application
Simply set Mode=2 under the [NDP Firmware] section in the config.ini file:

[NDP Firmware]
# select the function mode. This defines which [Function_x]
# block will be used. Function blocks define which images
# to load into the NDP120
# 1->Function_1;
# 2->Function_2;
# 3->Function_3; ...
Mode=2

[Function_1]
Description="Single Mic"
MCU=mcu_fw_120.synpkg
DSP=dsp_firmware.synpkg
DNN=menu_demo_512_general_newph_v103_rasyn_pdm0_ext_icm.synpkg

[Function_2]
Description="Dual Mic"
MCU=mcu_fw_120.synpkg
DSP=dsp_firmware_noaec_ff.synpkg
DNN=menu_demo_512_noaec_newph_v103_rasyn_pdm0_ext_icm.synpkg

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

mon2 — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:46:12 GMT

Thank you again Peter. Do not want to outstay my welcome but curious on the following:

1) are the PDM microphones specific to the applied firmware? That is, can we switch out the TDK MMICT5832 with perhaps the IM67D130AXTSA2 (Infineon)?

2) Would the microphone on the aux shown paddleboard be the same as the primary TDK microphone?

3) Are the DSP files user created or supplied by Syntiant?

This looks to be a very thought out board. You have answered most of the questions within a few minutes that have yet to be commented on by the factory on their rather dormant user forum. It appears they are only after the big fish to keep their (led) lights on. We faced issues with even the nicla voice upon start up. Posted the full solution and corrected procedure on the Edge Impulse user forum.

Very excited to test your board asap - ETA tomorrow / Friday.

Thanks again!!

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

peterfenn — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:22:24 GMT

Ongoing work is being done in this area. Theoretically, the 2nd mic will provide significant improvement in extracting keywords in a noisy environment, but we've seen mixed results thus far, with more refinement of this function still needed.

PS: Reason for the extended form-factor of the 2nd microphone add-on PCB assembly, is the requirement to have at least 71mm spacing between the two mics.

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

peterfenn — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:13:41 GMT

RE: RASynBoard schematic / dual microphone / far field support

mon2 — Wed, 08 Nov 2023 22:00:57 GMT

Thank you Peter for the very prompt reply. Does the DSP package permit the background noise cancellation support (ie.loud music playing and the NDP120 can still pickup the wake word / commands) ? Very interested to test this support which is lacking on the nicla voice single microphone board.