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Member's Forum A perspective on Testing.
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  • verification
  • testing
  • validation
  • physics
Related

A perspective on Testing.

DAB
DAB over 8 years ago

Testing is a natural scientific response to confirm or dispel an idea.

Testing falls into two primary functions, Verification and Validation.

 

Most people are familiar with Verification testing.  You use the tests to verify that the idea/device/system provides the expected outputs given the proper input stimulus.

 

In component testing, you want to verify that the device responds as designed or advertised.  I have had a lot of fun with the latter as some marketers just cannot help themselves when making outlandish claims for their new toys.

I worked as an Independent Verification and Validation engineer on some very large aerospace systems and I had a wonderful time deflating exotic ideas about the technology implementations being developed.

 

For the most part, Verification Testing is straight forward.  You establish the inputs and measure the outputs.  Standard black box testing technique.  The device either meets specification or it does not.

 

Validation Testing is similar but very different from Verification Testing.

 

Validation involves analyzing the resulting Verification Testing results to determine if the final product satisfies the intended uses of the product.

 

In essence, Validation assess the question of can the intended users, use the product to do the job they need it to do.

 

Depending upon your user base, this becomes a very difficult task.

Each user has a perceived notion of what the product needs to do for them.  Very subtle implementation decisions can result in a product that is technically perfect, but useless.  Sort of like contacting Microsoft Support!

 

In some cases, Validation testing takes you out of the comfortable area of specific input and output and into a more fuzzy world of user perception.  Not an easy task, thought there are some excellent analysis tools available to help resolve this level of testing.

 

Most of my current work involves Validating my current solution for a Unified Field Theory.

The issues involved are both technical and perception.  Many of the existing scientific theories are used with both verified test results and with rationalized validation through consensus.

 

This last issue is the biggest hurdle.  Especially since I bring into question the works of Nobel Laureates in Theoretical Physics for the past 120 years.

When I tried to verify their results, I discovered that most have never been really validated or indeed verified with hard testing.

 

That result surprised me.  I had been taught that science was built entirely by independently verified testing.

 

That is not the case with many of the current Theoretical Physics Theories.  The excuse has been based upon the level of complexity and untestable nature of the issues involved. 

 

Using standard analysis of public domain data, I have been able to show that most of these excuses are not true and that those theories are false.

 

So my advice on any of the current theories is to trust but verify.  There is nothing, including ideas, that cannot be tested.

If someone cannot provide a theoretical model that cannot be tested, then it should not be used until sufficient model definition is developed and adequate independent testing can occur.

 

DAB

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Top Replies

  • DAB
    DAB over 8 years ago in reply to mcb1 +4
    Hi Mark, When we stop learning, we are all doomed. I did not embark upon my journey for fame or fortune. Like Steven Hawking, I want to know how the Universe Works before I die. I now have an advantage…
  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 8 years ago in reply to DAB +4
    When we stop learning, we are all doomed. Correct. All I can do is plant the seeds, provide trail of bread crumbs, and let the curious follow the path to enlightenment. The books at least get my ideas…
  • DAB
    DAB over 8 years ago in reply to jw0752 +3
    You make a great straight man John. You hit the nail right on the head. No single test ever validated anything! Each test, no matter how elaborate can only provide you with a pass/fail on the specific…
Parents
  • jw0752
    jw0752 over 8 years ago

    Hi DAB,

     

    Testing for verification would seem to indicate that a positive truth value might be able to be assigned to the results of an experiment. The scientific process does not however allow for a positive result only a negative one. While we can show that a hypothesis is false by finding a contradiction no matter how many experiments that we run with positive results there may always be the next experiment that shows a contradiction. While many positive experimental results can increase our confidence in a prized hypothesis it can still never be validated as True. The scientifically minded person does not have a need for an inventory of things that are True but rather a set of useful ideas that so far give satisfactorily accurate predictions for the results of phenomenon or experiments. The scientifically minded person should always be ready to discard his idea tool or at least better define its operational parameters if it can be show to fail under certain circumstances. Newton's Physics is a good example of this. While much of Newton's Theory has been shown to fail under extreme conditions, (Speed, Gravitation) the laws are still within acceptable parameters for most human applications. So what is True. Not the Laws of Newton nor it seems the laws of Einstein as they too encounter contradictions when we move into the sub atomic realm.

     

    While you have some very interesting ideas it is hard to begin to use them for any practical purpose. Most people do not have the time for the re-education process that would be needed to add the new vocabulary and new thought procedures. Also my reading of current physics indicate that most of the current theory is being tested vigorously and ideas that fail the experiments are discarded or modified for special uses. If there was a need for a complete rewrite there would be many others up on the stage with you shouting for the new ideas.

     

    I offer the above as a trigger for the discussion that I know you would love to have.

     

    John

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  • DAB
    DAB over 8 years ago in reply to jw0752

    You make a great straight man John.

     

    You hit the nail right on the head.  No single test ever validated anything!

     

    Each test, no matter how elaborate can only provide you with a pass/fail on the specific question the test was to answer.  That is it.  No light bulb in the sky, no bolt of lightning, nothing.  Just one answer to a complex problem.

     

    As for "elevated" people, a good Phd friend of mine pointed out that as you get higher in the education and research structure, you actually know less and less about anything other than the specific issue you study or research.

    So anyone with letters after their name are really unqualified to speak on any issue other than their specific field of study.

     

    Plus you also identified the key issue.  Until a theory can be used to solve everyday problems, it is totally useless.

     

    That is why my specific investigations goes through the underlying issues, cites existing test and experimental data, but defines the "process" by which my theory would evolve over time to build what we can see and measure in the universe around us.

    I also introduce mathematical models that only require basic algebra and science to understand.

    The result is that my math, works, and you can apply all collected measurements and many observations to fully explain what happened and why.

     

    Try asking anyone with a Phd to do that and see what you get.

     

    Which brings us to the reason for my post and the identification of the Validation issue.

    When people can USE a theory, they validate it.

    If people cannot use a theory, then it provides no value.

     

    Believe me, by engineering use requirements are very high.  Hence my efforts over the last seven years to find answers about how the universe works so that people can solve everyday problems.  Not introduce alternate dimensions, uses, mass, energy, imaginary particles and fields, all of which are interesting but basically useless.

     

    DAB

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  • DAB
    DAB over 8 years ago in reply to jw0752

    You make a great straight man John.

     

    You hit the nail right on the head.  No single test ever validated anything!

     

    Each test, no matter how elaborate can only provide you with a pass/fail on the specific question the test was to answer.  That is it.  No light bulb in the sky, no bolt of lightning, nothing.  Just one answer to a complex problem.

     

    As for "elevated" people, a good Phd friend of mine pointed out that as you get higher in the education and research structure, you actually know less and less about anything other than the specific issue you study or research.

    So anyone with letters after their name are really unqualified to speak on any issue other than their specific field of study.

     

    Plus you also identified the key issue.  Until a theory can be used to solve everyday problems, it is totally useless.

     

    That is why my specific investigations goes through the underlying issues, cites existing test and experimental data, but defines the "process" by which my theory would evolve over time to build what we can see and measure in the universe around us.

    I also introduce mathematical models that only require basic algebra and science to understand.

    The result is that my math, works, and you can apply all collected measurements and many observations to fully explain what happened and why.

     

    Try asking anyone with a Phd to do that and see what you get.

     

    Which brings us to the reason for my post and the identification of the Validation issue.

    When people can USE a theory, they validate it.

    If people cannot use a theory, then it provides no value.

     

    Believe me, by engineering use requirements are very high.  Hence my efforts over the last seven years to find answers about how the universe works so that people can solve everyday problems.  Not introduce alternate dimensions, uses, mass, energy, imaginary particles and fields, all of which are interesting but basically useless.

     

    DAB

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