Just an idea...

Hi Wesley,

We have had this idea before.

One of the big impediments is some of the technology restrictions on some of the boards.

I suggest that you find a local maker space and donate your boards there or find some young budding makers in your area and pass them out.

DAB

DAB, what kind of technology restriction? I have always sent stuff here and there worldwide without problems. Is there something illegal ?

Enrico

Hi Enrico,

Some manufacturers must comply with technology export laws.

They always supply this information in the fine print, so you should at least review those notes before you ship a specific device to a specific country.

The last thing you need is to be put on a watch list or banned from flying over an inexpensive, but sensitive technology board.

Given the small quantities you are  trading, it is probably not a big deal, but all it takes is one complaint and you could be facing some serious legal action.

So please verify that you are not in violation.

I would hate to lose an Element14 member to some dungeon somewhere.

DAB

Hi DAB,

I know those restrictions, many and different depending on the country. Just as an example I have customers in Ecuador that for a period bought not only the printing software but also the bluetooth printers from Spain due to some restrictions on buying from China. At that time I asked to the local Spanish custom office and they explained me that to make this possible I had just to add something (maybe a screw it is sufficient) so the product is not sold from China to the customer view Spain but it is a different product because there is a value added to it. The same occurred to some thousand of bluetooth printers I sold to the Zimbabwe Gas Distribution Company. In that case I have reflashed the printers with the company logo printed just before any slip receipt to make this possible and I have done many shipments. In cases like these also the Courier (I mean a serious courier like USP of FedEx whichI have a contract as import/export operator) is very helpful and they always got me the right suggestion, including the pro-forma invoices to avoid any illegal action.

The worst case was when - as per the customer choice - I had to develop a BLE motor controller based on a Nordic IC that - due its militar range application - it was only authorised to be sold on the USA. In this case, very rare I should admit, it was the Nordic Europe that bought for me the small units needed for the prototypes and then they shipped tome Europe on Europe.

Another aspect that should be take in serious account is the authorisation of the exporter to manage outside shipment of any kind of stuff. This is the reason that at a very low price (10 euro / year) I am EORI and ROI subscriber (International Extra European Import/Export and Register of Intra-community Operators, for Europe).

But in the case I should send you any kind of board, from private to private, a used device, there is a declaration that I should compile that in few words say "material for development, personal use and non commercial. Not destined to reselling. Personal use for a collaborator". Together with this declaration I will declare 10$ as custom value as this is the minimum value that is not subject to custom taxes. In 90% of the cases I made a shipment of stuff like this, Packages are always arrived with the tape of "Custom controlled" and no exceptions have been raised at all.

As this sort of personal "board exchange" refers as far as I know to this last case I was surprised of these laws. I can investigate in depth next time I have to ship something to private, maybe I missed something.

Enrico

The question of the different voltage lines in Europe and USA maybe a serious problem but as far as I know today most of the power supply ae always multi-voltage, at least with a switch to set...

Enrico

I suspect that as long as you are doing just single boards that you are OK, though technically violating some of the rules.

For the most part they just want to prevent a lot of high technology getting to certain groups or countries.

Just the same, please do make sure that you are not doing something you should not.

Local exchanges are usually ok, but once you cross a national boundary, you should check first.  Forgiveness may not be an option.

DAB

DAB, reading your previous post I also thought to another aspect that makes the things strange and weird under this point of view. If there are so many limitations that I can't sent you a board that I made... What happens when I send stuff to the USA (most of my customers are there), hand-made small boards, via Tindie?

Enrico

Given what you have told me, I am assuming that you have already declared yourself or your business as a world wide export company.

I am also assuming that you have read and are complying with the applicable export laws.

At that point, all you need to do is document what you are sending and to whom and for what purpose.

I think the category of Open Source or Prototype devices get easy waivers as they are such small quantity as to be invisible to the prying eyes of most governments.

So as a one to one transfer, small quantities, I would say you are good.  If you are concerned then I highly suggest you consult an attorney with background in export laws.

You can probably also get advice from the EU commerce board as they have established the trading agreement between the EU and most countries.

This is one of the issues where given your small quantities, it just might be better to let sleeping dogs lie.

The last thing you need is to alert an over zealous government monitor who will probably bury you under paperwork or decide to make you a poster boy.

If you use UPS or Federal Express to ship to the US, then they are already taking care of the paperwork when you fill out the export form.

Like I said, for small items, you just declare what it is and what it costs and it ships.  QED!

DAB

I would hate to lose an Element14 member to some dungeon somewhere.

The english stopped sending criminals to Australia some time ago ... apparently they discovered the climate was much better so making them stay in England was more punisihing

It does appear that America seems to have the worst export laws.

Not sure what Technology they are trying to protect as most of it has long since been cloned or copied, so they are effectively losing sales to the asian suppliers.

I think this board donation is a great idea.

Mark

Given recent Chinese comments, I would say the US is protecting some very interesting and critical technology.

As we have seen in North Korea, the open transfer of technology in the hands of determined idiots can lead to bad projects.

Granted the US laws are extreme, but they are trying to preserve the rule of law in an environment rife with illegal technology copying and exploitation.

Please forgive us for trying to protect our investments.  We still believe in capitalism.

DAB

Granted the US laws are extreme, but they are trying to preserve the rule of law in an environment rife with illegal technology copying and exploitation.

Please forgive us for trying to protect our investments.  We still believe in capitalism.

I don't have any problems with that, but let's make everything a level playing field.

Here's a really good example.

NZ element14 lists Beagle Bone boards.

You can order them, BUT in order to receive them, you need to fill out an export form, that as I understand goes away to the UK to get approved.

This is to deliver the board ordered through the NZ website/store (goods are held in Australia) to a NZ address.

BUT it can get posted to an Australian address that day with no paperwork or anything else.

So I'm not sure what the export paperwork is protecting.

Mark

Almost the same everywhere

Almost the same everywhere