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PIR Sensor ultra sensitive

tonyd512
tonyd512 over 1 year ago

Hello,

New to Element 14

Needing a PIR sensor (or something more appropriate) sensitive enough to detect box elder bugs. They are about 1/4 inch long. Sensor needs to have short range maybe 3-4 ft or so.

ideally it would trigger a smart phone on a tripod aimed at the target area. These bugs crawl quite slowly mostly but do fly as well.

Need a little guidance choosing an appropriate sensor for the project. This will be indoors.

Tony D

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  • kmikemoo
    kmikemoo over 1 year ago +2
    While electronics would be cool, if you can't localize the point of entry based on sightings, I would go with a simpler approach. They could also be "replicating" inside. You might be able to secure…
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 1 year ago +1
    What's the actual goal? What is the use-case? By 'trigger a smart phone aimed at the target area' do you mean to trigger a smart phone camera? Or something else? If all you wish to do is to take photos…
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512 +1
    There are some interesting solutions described here: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/189943/how-can-i-quantify-difference-between-two-images There's a simple one mentioned there which is to just…
  • beacon_dave
    0 beacon_dave over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512

    For a longer term bug hunt solution you could perhaps consider adding a pan-tilt hat into the equation. That way you can run multiple interval captures in parallel, potentially covering a larger area.

    A camera slider might be another option for this type of surveillance as you can run the camera parallel to a wall.

    https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/pan-tilt-hat

    https://www.adafruit.com/product/3353

    https://www.waveshare.com/pan-tilt-hat.htm

    https://www.arducam.com/product/arducam-pan-tilt-platform-for-raspberry-pi-camera-2-dof-bracket-kit-with-digital-servos-and-ptz-control-broad-b0283/

    Lighting will indeed affect this, both in colour temperature and intensity. If you are using automatic iris on a camera then your depth of field will also reduce in lower levels of light potentially causing issues as well. If you are comparing between successive images though then it can be less of an issue as less variation between captures. Also some pre-processing can be done before the comparison and thresholds can be adjusted.

    You could perhaps attach a LED illuminator to the camera so as you are only illuminating the area being captured and keep it at a consistent level. 

    Ultrasonic sensors might be worth a look though as often insects can make a lot of noise at specific frequencies.

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  • kmikemoo
    0 kmikemoo over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512

    tonyd512 Bummer. One strong scent should be as good as another. Dawn dishwashing liquid has been a magic elixir for many other things.. maybe that.  Again, I wish you success.

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  • BigG
    0 BigG over 1 year ago in reply to beacon_dave
    beacon_dave said:
    Ultrasonic sensors might be worth a look though as often insects can make a lot of noise at specific frequencies.

    You may be on to something. I know Ultrasonic transducers/emitters are claimed to be able to repel rodents and insects etc. Maybe it could work in this scenario.

    Came across this blog that provides one persons experiences (with ants).

    https://www.tomsguide.com/news/i-used-an-ultrasonic-pest-repeller-against-an-ant-invasion-heres-what-happened

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  • tonyd512
    0 tonyd512 over 1 year ago in reply to kmikemoo

    A friend of mine suggested this radar detector:

    LD2410 sensor

    Couldn't find anyone using it for bug detection online with a cursory search....

    Thoughts anyone?

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  • genebren
    0 genebren over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512

    Another possibility might be Orange Oil.  It has been used to control (or discourage) termites.  We have been using in garden to control Fire Ants.

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  • shabaz
    0 shabaz over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512

    That's the sensor that was mentioned earlier as an example to read up on:

    /technologies/embedded/b/blog/posts/experimenting-with-microwave-based-sensors-for-presence-detection#mcetoc_1h0c077bia

    The LD2410 certainly can detect mouse-sized objects, but I didn't try anything smaller at the time. You'd need to give it a shot (or some other microwave sensor, if there is any that looks more suitable out there) to see if it is suitable, since probably the manufacture doesn't even have data for that (a lot of these low-cost microwave sensors might have been designed for human presence). There's a chance it could work, but really needs experimentation. A camera based sensor is possibly more effective, but needs processing as discussed by a few people.

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  • tonyd512
    0 tonyd512 over 1 year ago in reply to shabaz

    Sorry this is a lot of information to digest

    Thank you so much for the help

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  • shabaz
    0 shabaz over 1 year ago in reply to tonyd512

    No problem, some of the info on engineering websites will be hard to follow initially, plus it's just the nature of the beast, that many raw sensors require some testing or bits of additional hardware/processing/software, many are not pre-packaged and configured, but if you have any questions people here can help. 

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  • colporteur
    0 colporteur over 1 year ago in reply to shabaz

    I've used some radar sensors from DFRobot. They have a unit https://www.dfrobot.com/product-2648.html similar to your image. I haven't used this device but I was curious of limit .75 meter minimum. How successful was your sensor on small object being close to the sensor.

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  • shabaz
    0 shabaz over 1 year ago in reply to colporteur

    Hi Sean,

    That's the one! I got mine from AliExpress, where it's known as HLK-LD2410, it looks identical.

    I suspect there would be no issue with detecting objects nearer than 0.75 meters but with an inaccurate distance measurement perhaps, but to be honest I can't recall much. I didn't do a lot of testing at the time, I was more focused on getting the code operational to make it work with Arduino, Pi Pico and PC, so that I'd have some flexibility to experiment later, and then I moved on to something else. I'll have to revisit it, and give it a shot (possibly at the weekend).

    It's for sure a fascinating sensor, well worth experimenting with.

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