Free energy?

You asked how a Peltier theromoelectic device works.

The 40x40 mm device mentioned contains a zigzig path for electricity.

The trick is that all of the 'up' pillars are made of a p-type semiconductor and all of the 'down' pillars in the zigzag are made of an n-type semiconductor.  Metal tracks printed on the white topplate and bottom plate link p to n. 

If heat flows from one plate to the other, it is carried mainly by holes in the p-type pillars and mainly by electrons in the n-type pillars.  These have vastly different momentum, possibly of opposite direction, so net current has to flow in order to maintain a temperature difference across the cell.

I'd like to go into it in more detail.  There is an academic at Cardiff uni who looked at these properly.

It is interesting that anything hot stuck onto one side of a Peltier cell can generate electricity while there is cold on one plate and hot on the other.  For example an engine coolant on the hot side and a fan-cooled plate on the other.

It is still a machine so don't expect to drive an electric car solely from electricity generated from cooling the batteries of that electric car.

I agree that you could never get more energy than what was inputed.  If this was true that person would be one rich person.  I am also a big camper and found a company that produces a cook top that also allows you to charge a device while cooking.  The company is called BioLite.

Technically, the Sun outputs much more energy than we could ever use without cost to produce.

The real issue is collecting and using energy from a variety of sources where the cost to collect and distribute falls within an economical zone.

We just need to get more creative in developing methods to capture the abundant "Free" energy around us.

Just my Opinion,

DAB

Absolutely! There is enough thermal energy bombarding the earth daily, to provide all our enegy needs.

.. If only we could capture it!

The focus has always been to 'intercept' the thermal 'flow' and do work in the process - one has (say) a parabolic reflector focussing onto a boiler, and vent the boiling steam through a turbine.. this effectively allows the heat to do work (turn the turbine, the mechanical resistance of which is determined by the load, which is where the useful work is done) and the heat is disipated (goes more entropic, is defocussed, more spread out) according to the natural order of the universe.

The "trouble" with this scheme (and, for that matter, every scheme [including peltier] which relied on thermal difference) is that loads of potential energy which could be captured must be lost.

What we need, is some 'collector' which 'sucks' thermal energy from its 'substrate' , converts this to electrical energy which does work 'remotely' and causes cooling of the 'substrate' as a 'byproduct' ... Such a collector would collect more incedent thermal energy because it would be cold and non-radiating, it would not require any 'sink' to provide differential temperature, because the load it is driving would effectively be the 'sink'.

What I think we need is some way to rectify and collect the thermal noise found in all conductors / semiconductors, and to do this in a way which causes actual molecular / atomic movement / vibrations to be reduced in this process, therebye causing cooling.

I have been "working" on this for years but am not getting anywhere - simply dont have funds or a lab capable of the other disciplines required to really test the hypothesis - in particular, chemistry and manafacturing of specific semiconductor substrates etc is needed - using ready made semiconductor parts and materials doesnt give what I am looking for - or at least, doesnt give enough that I can measure it!

Of course - I may be completely mad!  ;-)

Fred

Personally, I find that sanity is just social concensus. 6443.contentimage_938.png

I am amazed at the number of people that think we have an energy shortage.  From my analysis, we are using just a small fraction of the energy freely available around us.  What we lack is innovation and unique ideas.

That is one of the reasons I spend time researching atmospheric lightning.  Talk about an untapped energy source, it's potential is staggering.

But as you point out, I too may be completely mad!  However, I do have a report from a BWC doctor who claims I have significant issues since my accident, which I took as a compliment as I do not want to be like everyone else.

Just my opinion.

DAB

Personally,

I find the idea of having endless energy source to be converted to others is possible but not in near future for big scaled devices. Because we are missing the others while thinking about others( eg solar power). Technology is speeding up with nano-scale studies and production. I think we can use a nanotube to create energy by just using the vibration of its own. The things that we know in the name of science is just a droplet from the ocean. For instance how a molecular robots are getting their energy to move ?(I don't exactly know). On the other hand we'll be using superconducting wires everywhere soon to avoid the loss on transportation, and we are developing more efficient supercaps to store.

I am sure that we are going to get our energy for free by just letting do the nature's job.

Sadly, nothing is free!

The energy may be freely available, but it still takes technology and infrastructure to capture and use.  Yes technology will eventually come to our aid, but right now we cannot predict exactly when to solutions will appear.

That said, as long as we continue to search for solutions, the better chance we have to find useful applications along the way.

Just a thought,

DAB

Been dealing with and teaching (telecom and IT systems) DC and AC power systems for the past 30 years. Doing so has resulted in much research and study concerning electrical energy usage. Not only conceptually but in all aspects of the field including engineering, installation, problem resolution and maintenance. Having said all of that I can tell you that the time now is right for a national and/or world move to the utilization of DC instead of AC as our choice  for not only the transmission of electrical power but but also detailed use. Along with such a move we should incorporate the hydrogen fuel cell. Doing so would practically eliminate the antiquated AC grid system. With homes and business having their own hydrogen fuel cell ( installed and owned by the local power companies) there would be no need for an electrical grid. Outages would also occur less often. The more efficient DC motors could be used. In home and business voltage levels could be reduced drastically, thus being safer. The economy would get a tremendous boost from the technology needs as we would move from AC input to DC for any and all devices. Oh! and don't forget, hydrogen is the most plentiful element in the universe. We need only use natural gas or propane to act at the catalyst for extracting the hydrogen.  Many will scoff and say hydrogen use is too volatile but I remind that gasoline is also volatile.

Certainly in data centers that have power going through batteries in a UPS, a pretty good

case can be made for keeping the power DC from the UPS to the computing equipment.

http://hightech.lbl.gov/documents/data_centers/DCDemoFinalReport.pdf

DAB wrote :  >> "That is one of the reasons I spend time researching atmospheric lightning.  Talk about an untapped energy source, it's potential is staggering." <<

I have done some feasibility studies related to capture of atmospheric electrical energy, including construction of some equipment to measure what might be available.. There are two primary sources of this energy IMO - One is triboelectric, the other is the dielectric 'charge distribution'.

We live in the dielectric of a huge capacitor (close to the -ve plate) - the electrosphere is a highly conductive positively charged "plate" (Ozone being the primary conductor or "foil") and the earth is the negetive "plate" - there are hundreds of kV between these (~300kV), and a potential gradient from earth to the electrosphere (+100V/m sometimes).. But the resistivity of air is high (even when moisture laden) and one cannot just put a collection conductor at 100m and get a usable current - one cannot even measure the voltage without an electrostatic meter, as the loading of even a normal active hi-z meter is too great - FET or VT VM's can just about work sometimes - but there certainly isnt enough current to do anything useful - even with a large collection area.

I think that if one could get a low z conductor up to the electrosphere, one could tap the HV there - but getting a wire up to the electrosphere isnt practical.. Collecting lightning (which is mostly the result of thermally induced triboelectric interacations) is, as far as I can see, impractical - it depends on intermittant atmospheric effects... One would, I think, need to implement a more reliable triboelectric mechanism.

I have devised one possible way to 'tap' the electrosphere - but alas, even the crudest "proof of concept" type of experiment is way beyond the budget of anyone I know. I think that a high power lazer which caused ionization of air in its path, could provide a low z "wire" to exist momentarily up to the electrosphere.. It the lazer fires through a collecting conductor, I think that the ionized conduction path might cause enough conduction current to initiate a plasma 'wire' which would charge the collector and then cease to exist.. The charge on the collector could then be converted to a usable voltage through some mechanism (perhaps an electrostatic motor) and used to provide output power and power to drive the lazer.. The lazer would need to fire a pulse whenever the colloctors potential dropped below some threshold level.

I think some caution is advisable with any sheme that employs our earths electrical environment as an energy source - If we were too greedy or disrespectful we might upset some critical balance we are not aware of - oh - I think it highly unlikely that there is any real risk - but who would have guessed that CFC's would cause the massive destruction they did?

Fred.