Is it possible to get a POWER-based SBC?

Question

Hello,

I am interested in the POWER ISA, and I know about projects such as Talos II (https://raptorcs.com/content/TL2WK2/intro.html) and Microwatt (https://github.com/antonblanchard/microwatt), and so on.

I would like to experiment with POWER-based SBC's. They don't have to be POWER9 because I've already got that particular CPU covered in the form of my Talos II (although still a work in progress to get it provisioned properly).

I would like to purchase a few POWER-based SBC's and build a small, quiet cluster. The intended use cases are as follows:

general purpose computing
digital signal processing
self-education about:
- POWER ISA
- clusters and distributed computing, including HA
- formal reasoning about the state of a distributed system

So far I have found

NXP is producing interesting POWER SoC's (https://www.nxp.com/products/processors-and-microcontrollers/power-architecture:POWER-ARCHITECTURE)
Solid Run is producting SBC's of the "NXP family" but none of these include POWER CPU's (https://shop.solid-run.com/product-category/embedded-computers/nxp-family/)

I am continuing to researcg, but if you know of anybody who is producing POWER-based SBC's then I would be greatly appreciative if you could please, please let me know. Thank you!!

Kind regards,

Andrew

gdstew · Answer

I'm just replying to the original post. I just happened to know about this one and after verifying that it was still available, passed it on to Andrew. I would imagine that there is some interest in Power (more likely PowerPC) based SBC's but have no idea if there is enough to sustain a market for them at prices that are fairly close to ARM offerings. I'm sure there are some out there that would be willing to pay something extra for the PowerPC just to work with it. Just FYI There is a Power9 based PC called the Raptor Talos II Lite (there is also a dual CPU socket server version) that was recently released. Base price is $1399 USD without a CPU (motherboard + PSU + case + heatsink). The CPU costs (all USD) are for 4-core POWER9 CPU - $375, 8-core CPU - $595, 18-core CPU - $1375, and 22-core CPU - $2575. Although these prices are on the high side if I had a spare few thousand dollars laying around I would be very tempted to buy one.

ullbeking · Answer

Thank you gdstew , this information is very helpful. In fact, I think that looking at PPC32-based SBC's would be most fruitful, and these are some excellent starting points. Re: Raptor's Talos II, I actually have one of these ( https://www.raptorcs.com/content/TL2WK2/intro.html ) and there have been a few teething issues but finally it's getting sorted. I intend for this to be my primary workstation+server, and once I get some issues with PSU's sorted out, (touch wood) I hope that I will be ready to put it into production. It's an amazing machine, but you have to really care about what it offers you for it to be a good investment. And because the Talos II is so large, I would like a smaller, SBC-sized machine or cluster of SBC-sized machines to learn the fundamentals of working with this architecture and ISA. The Blackbird would be a great machine for a quiet workstation. I intend to get one of those too but not until the Talos II is working 100%. It's very late here now (London, UK) and I'd better get to bed. Thank you all for your answers. I'll be coming back to this thread tomorrow. Good night all!!

Former Member · Answer

I do not know your motivation for investing in Power technology as a " primary workstation+server" nor am I challenging it. I was also a Unix PPC developer in years long past and found them to be just as good as DEC VAX or Intel-based systems. But, as you can see on the Internet, manufacturers interested in small products are abandoning Power technologies (or never considered them) in favor of ARM, Intel, or AMD. Its all about money and momentum. Regarding the Genesi company ( https://genesi.company/aboutus ), they seems focused on (freescale today) ARM-based hardware. For example, https://genesi.company/products/efika/5200b (discontinued), they state: " The 5200B-based version of the EfikaPPC mainboard has been discontinued and was replaced with the EFIKA MX . While the EfikaPPC is no longer in stock at Genesi, it is still available with resellers. " EFIKA MX (also discontinued) is ARM-based. Actually, a lot of their products and "Projects" have been discontinued. That is a bit worrying to me. Power architecture-based products may see a resurgence in the future but that is speculation on my part. I suspect that IBM is trying to salvage their investment in the i-Series. Keep an eye on https://openpowerfoundation.org/the-next-step-in-the-openpower-foundation-journey/ In the UK: https://www.broadberry.co.uk/tyan-rackmount-servers You might investigate Broadberry for leads. Tyan has been manufacturing Power-based products using Broadberry and others as distributors. It looks like all of the new and continuing Power-based development is focused on rack and server. Whatever you decide to do, I suggest avoiding discontinued, ebbing, or inactive products so as to continue getting consumer support in terms of documentation, user forums, and product updates. Good luck.

gdstew · Answer

I'm not sure what the difference between Power and Power PC is however you can get a relatively inexpensive Power PC SBC here: https://www.directron.com/efika.html Here are a couple more links to useful information: https://genesi.company/products/efika/5200b https://genesi.company/support/efika They have some interesting features including a PCI slot and a ATA/IDE hard drive interface however they lack any GPIO. You could find a PCI bus parallel printer card to provide some GPIO and the last generation of parallel printer interfaces came with EPP and EPC modes that include much more powerful interface capabilities. I have no idea if there are usable Linux drivers for these interfaces anymore but at one time they were used for zip drives and other peripherals so there might be, There should be drivers for the standard and bi-directional modes for the printer interface (these are usually supported on cards with the advanced modes too) which would give some GPIO capabilities. Finally It does have 2 - USB 1 interfaces which can also be used with other interface boards for GPIO.

Former Member · Answer

I cannot find one that isn't too old (E.g. Amiga & PowerMAC stuff) or too expensive for me (E.g. made by IBM or sold by Raptor).

You might want to keep in touch with OpenPower at https://openpowerfoundation.org/technical/resource-catalog/ if you are not yet aware of them. I believe that somethings are going to happen for OpenPower architectures but maybe not in the saturated SBC market.

Good luck. Please update if you ever find anything related to your search.

Former Member · Answer

Apparently, University of California and Stanford University are both actively engaged in RISC-V platforms. Here is a list of SoC efforts: https://riscv.org/risc-v-cores/ It's not just hardware. There is also a serious effort in software development too: https://riscv.org/software-status/ One implementation: https://www.hackster.io/news/seeed-studio-announces-gd32-risc-v-development-board-its-latest-gigadevice-gd32v-powered-de… This RISC-V SBC might be interesting to you: https://www.sifive.com/boards/hifive-unleashed

Is it possible to get a POWER-based SBC?

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