Off board components

dingebre wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 05:03

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel

mounted pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included in the

bill of materials.

You have to be consistent with what a BOM is for and what a "board" means.

In any place I've worked with, you wouldn't want a panel mount switch on

the same BOM as that of the board.  The board needs pads or a connector for

the switch wires, so that is shown on the schematic and goes on the BOM for

the board.  The switch goes on the BOM of another assembly.  Then the

larger unit is another assembly that shows the board and the switch with

cable installed onto the board as subassemblies.

You can put a comment in the schematic explaining what is intended to be

connected to the pads or connector that is on the board, but that's as far

as it goes and should go.  Think tree structure.

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca

"David Ingebretsen" <dingebre@3dphysics.net> wrote in message

news:hmdf0t$haa$1@cheetah.cadsoft.de...

I've been working my way through all the example projects I found on the

Cadsoft site, wow... They are useful.

 

Because I want to develop good habits from  the start and I'm trying very

hard to unlearn some very awkward techniques I bring from the "other"

commercial software I was using, so I really appreciate any advice you can

give me.

 

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel mounted

pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included in the bill of

materials.

 

So, what is the preferred method to do this? I see most just leave them

off

the schematic and use a connector or pads for the off board stuff.

 

In the "other" software, I created some panel components that just had

pads

for the PCB package. It worked OK.

 

Are there already some "off board" components like this? I've tried every

keyword I could think of to search the libraries, but no luck yet.

 

Thanks for you patience with a new user.

 

David

 

Hi David,

you can do that if you want to by drawing your own symbol that come without

any pins. Ok, the symbol should look like it has some, but from eagle

perspective, it doesn't. That enables you to generate devices without the

need of packages. But you can't use the standard net command to make

connections. By choosing special reference designators, you can easily

separate these parts from the rest of the bom.

Regards,

Carsten

On 2/28/2010 9:21 AM, Olin Lathrop wrote:

dingebre wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 05:03

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel

mounted pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included in the

bill of materials.

 

You have to be consistent with what a BOM is for and what a "board"

means. In any place I've worked with, you wouldn't want a panel mount

switch on

the same BOM as that of the board. The board needs pads or a connector for

the switch wires, so that is shown on the schematic and goes on the BOM for

the board. The switch goes on the BOM of another assembly. Then the

larger unit is another assembly that shows the board and the switch with

cable installed onto the board as subassemblies.

 

You can put a comment in the schematic explaining what is intended to be

connected to the pads or connector that is on the board, but that's as far

as it goes and should go. Think tree structure.

Olin, in large work environments, that's the way it should be. However

for someone who does smallish projects and assembly, or does it all

themselves, it's helpful to integrate into the board's BOM so that you

don't forget to order those parts.

Also, for someone like me who changes things fairly often to support new

features on a board, it would be hard to manage multiple sets of parts

lists for multiple devices each with multiple versions... To stay sane,

I have to keep it in the schematics. I actually made a part that's

nothing but a value-label so I can "create" those things I need just by

putting in it's part number as the value. Crude but fast and effective.

Carsten Wille wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 09:48

"David Ingebretsen" <dingebre@3dphysics.net[/email]> wrote in message

news:hmdf0t$haa$1@cheetah.cadsoft.de...[/email]

I've been working my way through all the example projects I found

on the

Cadsoft site, wow... They are useful.

 

Because I want to develop good habits from  the start and I'm

trying very

hard to unlearn some very awkward techniques I bring from the

"other"

commercial software I was using, so I really appreciate any advice

you can

give me.

 

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel

mounted

pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included in the

bill of

materials.

 

So, what is the preferred method to do this? I see most just leave

them

off

the schematic and use a connector or pads for the off board stuff.

 

In the "other" software, I created some panel components that just

had

pads

for the PCB package. It worked OK.

 

Are there already some "off board" components like this? I've tried

every

keyword I could think of to search the libraries, but no luck yet.

 

Thanks for you patience with a new user.

 

David

 

 

Hi David,

 

you can do that if you want to by drawing your own symbol that come

without

any pins. Ok, the symbol should look like it has some, but from eagle

perspective, it doesn't. That enables you to generate devices without

the

need of packages. But you can't use the standard net command to make

connections. By choosing special reference designators, you can easily

 

separate these parts from the rest of the bom.

 

Regards,

Carsten

Thanks Carsten,

Carsten, That's an excellent way to do it and combine the on and off board

parts in one schematic.

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca

Olin wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 07:21

dingebre wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 05:03

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel

mounted pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included in

the bill of materials.

 

You have to be consistent with what a BOM is for and what a "board"

means.  In any place I've worked with, you wouldn't want a panel mount

switch on the same BOM as that of the board.  The board needs pads or a

connector for the switch wires, so that is shown on the schematic and

goes on the BOM for the board.  The switch goes on the BOM of another

assembly.  Then the larger unit is another assembly that shows the board

and the switch with cable installed onto the board as subassemblies.

 

You can put a comment in the schematic explaining what is intended to

be connected to the pads or connector that is on the board, but that's as

far as it goes and should go.  Think tree structure.

Thanks Olin,

I agree with your comments for the circumstances you cite. The difference

for me is I am doing this for my own personal use and maybe to share with

others who have the same hobby (DIY synthesizers) (similar to the situation

Travis describes). In that community, it is typical to include "off board"

components on the schematic somewhere.

However, in a "tree" frame of mind (good advice) I could do the board in

one schematic, use pads or connectors, then do a sceond schematic only that

shows the pot/jack/switch connections. Both schematics can be part of the

same project. Thanks

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca

Travis G wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 11:45

On 2/28/2010 9:21 AM, Olin Lathrop wrote:

dingebre wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 05:03

I want to show off PCB components on the schematic, like a panel

mounted pot, or switch, or jack because I want them to be included

in the

bill of materials.

 

You have to be consistent with what a BOM is for and what a

"board"

means. In any place I've worked with, you wouldn't want a panel

mount

switch on

the same BOM as that of the board. The board needs pads or a

connector for

the switch wires, so that is shown on the schematic and goes on the

BOM for

the board. The switch goes on the BOM of another assembly. Then

the

larger unit is another assembly that shows the board and the switch

with

cable installed onto the board as subassemblies.

 

You can put a comment in the schematic explaining what is intended

to be

connected to the pads or connector that is on the board, but that's

as far

as it goes and should go. Think tree structure.

 

Olin, in large work environments, that's the way it should be. However

 

for someone who does smallish projects and assembly, or does it all

themselves, it's helpful to integrate into the board's BOM so that you

 

don't forget to order those parts.

 

Also, for someone like me who changes things fairly often to support

new

features on a board, it would be hard to manage multiple sets of parts

 

lists for multiple devices each with multiple versions... To stay sane,

 

I have to keep it in the schematics. I actually made a part that's

nothing but a value-label so I can "create" those things I need just by

 

putting in it's part number as the value. Crude but fast and effective.

Interesting comment Travis. Thanks

David

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca

 

Interesting comment Travis. Thanks

 

David

One problem is that most of the BOM creation script will not export

those parts because they have no package. So, you can either create a

package with no nothing in it to use as a placeholder, or, what I did

was modify the ULP.

The modification does create the possibility of schematic parts such as

Vcc and GND being included in the BOM under certain situations, but

that's easy to post-process or modify the ulp to exclude in the future.

If you want my modified version, let me know.

Travis G wrote on Sun, 28 February 2010 12:12

 

Interesting comment Travis. Thanks

 

David

 

One problem is that most of the BOM creation script will not export

those parts because they have no package. So, you can either create a

package with no nothing in it to use as a placeholder, or, what I did

was modify the ULP.

 

The modification does create the possibility of schematic parts such as

 

Vcc and GND being included in the BOM under certain situations, but

that's easy to post-process or modify the ulp to exclude in the future.

 

If you want my modified version, let me know.

Thank you Travis. I'd love the modified ULP. I've got enough to learn just

using Eagle. I haven't written a line of C or C++ for 20 years. I'm saving

ULP creation for down the road...

David

email: mailto:dingebre@3dphysics.net

web: www.CFandE.com   - work

web: www.xmission.com/~dingebre    - hobby

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca

Thank you Travis. I'd love the modified ULP. I've got enough to learn just

using Eagle. I haven't written a line of C or C++ for 20 years. I'm saving

ULP creation for down the road...

 

David

 

email: mailto:dingebre@3dphysics.net

web: www.CFandE.com - work

web: www.xmission.com/~dingebre - hobby

Here you go. The modifications are minor. Search TG in the ULP to find

my modifications and where to add your own if you decide to exclude

other symbols from the BOM.

Travis G wrote on Mon, 01 March 2010 10:13

#usage "<b>Bill Of Material</b><p>\n"

"Generates a board's Bill Of Material.<p>\n"

 

  deleted to avoid clutter...

Thanks Travis. Works like a charm.

David

--

Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca