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EAGLE User Support (English) Simple polygons producing large gerber files
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Related

Simple polygons producing large gerber files

Former Member
Former Member over 15 years ago

Guys,

 

I'm making a planar PCB antenna.  So, I have two polygons which are

essentially ~200mm x 15mm rectangles with a 45 degree chamfer on one

corner on each shape.  I drew these shape on the top copper layer with

the polygon tool.  When I generate gerber files they warn me that the

shapes on signals N$2 and N$3 (the two polygons) will generate large

gerber files, and in fact I get about a ~450kb gerber file.

 

For the life of me I can't see why this should be the case, each polygon

is simply defined by five x,y coordinates which are all nice integer

numbers in mm. The application I'm using to read this gerber data is

having issues with this size gerber file.

 

On a related subject - the two polygons are mirror images reflected

across the vertical axis.  I thought that I could just draw one polygon

and then mirror it.  Unfortunately, mirroring also flips it to the

bottom layer of the board.  Is there a way to mirror an object and have

it stay on the original layer?  It not this would be a nice feature to

have.

 

-Michael

 

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago

    The line width of the polygon can make a difference.

     

    "Michael Sansom" <mssansom@hotmail.com> wrote in message

    news:i033g5$s30$1@cheetah.cadsoft.de...

    Guys,

    >

    I'm making a planar PCB antenna.  So, I have two polygons which are

    essentially ~200mm x 15mm rectangles with a 45 degree chamfer on one

    corner on each shape.  I drew these shape on the top copper layer with the

    polygon tool.  When I generate gerber files they warn me that the shapes

    on signals N$2 and N$3 (the two polygons) will generate large gerber

    files, and in fact I get about a ~450kb gerber file.

    >

    For the life of me I can't see why this should be the case, each polygon

    is simply defined by five x,y coordinates which are all nice integer

    numbers in mm. The application I'm using to read this gerber data is

    having issues with this size gerber file.

    >

    On a related subject - the two polygons are mirror images reflected across

    the vertical axis.  I thought that I could just draw one polygon and then

    mirror it.  Unfortunately, mirroring also flips it to the bottom layer of

    the board.  Is there a way to mirror an object and have it stay on the

    original layer?  It not this would be a nice feature to have.

    >

    -Michael

     

     

     

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago

    On 6/25/2010 1:27 PM, Michael Sansom wrote:

    Guys,

    >

    I'm making a planar PCB antenna. So, I have two polygons which are

    essentially ~200mm x 15mm rectangles with a 45 degree chamfer on one

    corner on each shape. I drew these shape on the top copper layer with

    the polygon tool. When I generate gerber files they warn me that the

    shapes on signals N$2 and N$3 (the two polygons) will generate large

    gerber files, and in fact I get about a ~450kb gerber file.

    >

    For the life of me I can't see why this should be the case, each polygon

    is simply defined by five x,y coordinates which are all nice integer

    numbers in mm. The application I'm using to read this gerber data is

    having issues with this size gerber file.

    >

    On a related subject - the two polygons are mirror images reflected

    across the vertical axis. I thought that I could just draw one polygon

    and then mirror it. Unfortunately, mirroring also flips it to the bottom

    layer of the board. Is there a way to mirror an object and have it stay

    on the original layer? It not this would be a nice feature to have.

    >

    -Michael

    Gerber polygons are made by painting in lines, so if your lines are thin

    there will be millions of them. Set the width of the polygon border as

    large as you can and still make your shape.

     

    In v4, you can copy, then mirror the polygon like you did to the other

    side and then just change layer to put it back where you want it.

     

     

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago in reply to Former Member

     

     

    In v4, you can copy, then mirror the polygon like you did to the other

    side and then just change layer to put it back where you want it.

     

     

    Thanks to both of you.  That was the problem.  I was thinking that

    gerber was a vector format instead of a rasterized format.

     

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago in reply to Former Member

    Michael Sansom schrieb:

     

    Thanks to both of you.  That was the problem.  I was thinking that

    gerber was a vector format instead of a rasterized format.

     

    Gerber is a vector format. But how would you fill a polygon with

    ambiguous "holes" of any possible shape in it?

     

    Tilmann

     

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago in reply to Former Member

    Tilmann Reh wrote:

    Michael Sansom schrieb:

     

    >> Thanks to both of you.  That was the problem.  I was thinking that

    >> gerber was a vector format instead of a rasterized format.

     

    Gerber is a vector format. But how would you fill a polygon with

    ambiguous "holes" of any possible shape in it?

     

    Tilmann

     

    Well, you could just specify in the vector format that the interior of

    the polygon has a "filled" attribute and have shapes interior to the

    polygon (say circles for instance for via clearances) which have a

    "void" attribute.  I don't really see any technical need to raster lines

    of some thickness to fill a polygon.  If I am not mistaken other non-pcb

    layout vector formats used in the graphics industry do the former rather

    than the latter.

     

    Of course, the gerber format has a long legacy that is intimately tied

    to the equipment that manufactured the films used to expose photoresist.

      Specifically, I suspect the decision of those that specified the way

    gerber uses raster lines to fill polygon copper shapes goes back to the

    old aperture wheels originally used to expose the films.  It certainly

    make sense if you think about it from that point of view.  Of course the

    gerber format could have chosen to just mark polygons (or any shape for

    that matter) as "filled" or "void".  This would have resulted in more

    compact files, but it would have relied on the photo plotters to decide

    how to use the available aperture wheel to fill or void the shapes.

    Probably would have lead to slight differences in the output films of

    various plotters and would have required more processing power in those

    machines, which was probably the deciding factor back in the dark ages

    when the industry was just moving away from hand layouts done with

    acetate and tape when processors where small, slow, and had very limited

    memory.

     

    Not really criticizing the gerber format, just didn't realize how it

    worked.  Now that I know it makes perfect sense why thin lines make

    larger gerber data on filled polygons.

     

    Thanks,

     

    Michael

     

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  • Former Member
    Former Member over 15 years ago in reply to Former Member

    "Tilmann Reh" <usenet2007nospam@autometer.de> wrote in message

    news:i0495d$m95$1@cheetah.cadsoft.de...

    Michael Sansom schrieb:

    >

    >> Thanks to both of you.  That was the problem.  I was thinking that

    >> gerber was a vector format instead of a rasterized format.

    >

    Gerber is a vector format. But how would you fill a polygon with

    ambiguous "holes" of any possible shape in it?

    >

    Tilmann

     

    Since I got into this subject while doing my own gerber export ulp, the

    subject got my attention.

    Gerber274x has support for polygon filling but with limitations. It can only

    be used to fill areas with no holes. Unfortunately Eagle's contour can not

    be mapped directly unless it has no 'negative' contours (see doc on

    UL_POLYGON). In my opinion it should be possible to rework the contour

    algorithm so that it cuts a slot of width 0 into the hole areas, and work

    around them and back. This would make it possible to use 274x polygon

    fill's, and probably speed up Eagle's rendering engine a lot as well.

    I do see that it can get complex if there exist no direct line between the

    contours, but it should also be possible to do a zigzag slot if needed.

     

    (Simple example image attached)

     

     

    begin 666 contourexplan.PNG

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