Bug in 7.3, can't export to TIF file

Am 24.07.2015 um 14:35 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

In version 7.3 on Windows 7 64 bit, there seems to be a bug in exporting a

board to a TIF image file.  In the board editor, if I run "EXPORT IMAGE

\temp\a.tif" I always get a popup that says "Out of memory while writing

'/temp/a.tif'".  This happens regardless of resolution.  For example,

"EXPORT IMAGE \temp\a.tif 50" fails the same way, even though that would

have only required 320 x 552 pixels in my case.

This seems to be a problem that came with the newer Qt version

we are using since EAGLE 7.3.0. We will check this......

--

Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Best regards

Richard Hammerl

  CadSoft Support -- hotline@cadsoft.de

  FAQ: http://www.cadsoft.de/training/faq/

CadSoft Support wrote on Mon, 27 July 2015 07:53

This seems to be a problem that came with the newer Qt version

we are using since EAGLE 7.3.0. We will check this......

I'm now at version 7.5.0, and this is indeed fixed.

However, you broke something else in the process.  Now the TIF file gets

written using CCITT (old fax) compression when the monochrome box is

checked.  This was never the case before.  Lots of software doesn't handle

this compression scheme, including what I call from ULPs and scripts to do

various things.  LZW compression or LZW with forward differencing are fine

and pretty much universally supported.

PLEASE RETURN THE TIF FILE WRITING FEATURE TO THE WAY IT WAS IN VERSION 5.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

On 12/2/2015 9:05 AM, Olin Lathrop wrote:

I'm now at version 7.5.0, and this is indeed fixed.

 

However, you broke something else in the process.  Now the TIF file gets

written using CCITT (old fax) compression when the monochrome box is

checked.  This was never the case before.  Lots of software doesn't handle

this compression scheme, including what I call from ULPs and scripts to do

various things.  LZW compression or LZW with forward differencing are fine

and pretty much universally supported.

 

PLEASE RETURN THE TIF FILE WRITING FEATURE TO THE WAY IT WAS IN VERSION 5.

Hi Olin,

Sorry for the delay, haven't been able to get to the forums the last few

days.

I have just now reported this to the devs.

Best Regards,

Jorge Garcia

Am 01.06.2016 um 23:10 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

Joop_ wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:06

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

 

Too late now anyway, but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

 

Actual 6.6

because is has NO hierarchical structure (HS) that hardly works in

schematics and not at all in boards.

I'm not gonna pay for less than half of a new "feature" HS in  version 7

and  no one knows  when this will be working properly, perhaps in

version 8 or 9? Or will it ever?

I don't blame cadsoft for this kind of business because they are  not

the own boss anymore. If this business continues, in version 13 we might

have a new feature like "we have added another semicolon in the

description".

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Jorge Garcia wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 12:11

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to

the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things

that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in

7.6.

 

I wasn't aware of this issue. I have reported it as well and will

follow

up once I hear something.

That's just one of several similar ones that I picked off the top of my

head.

Also off the top of my head, there's another like this in the library

editor.  Alt-L,D and Alt-L,S get you to devices and symbols respectively.

However, Alt-L,P doesn't get you to packages.  That's because someone had

the brilliant idea to use P as the shortcut key to two different menu

entries, even though the menu isn't that long and a little bit of thought

would have allowed for unique keys for each entry.  This has been broken

for a while, since version 5 at least.

C'mon guys.  This stuff isn't hard, it just takes someone to actually care

about keyboard usability.  There are quite a number of such things all thru

Eagle, and my impression is that the list gets bigger every release.  Don't

get me started on the keyboard (un)usability of the auto-router, especially

the new interface.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Joop_ wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:06

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

Too late now anyway, but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Olin wrote on Fri, 20 May 2016 14:32

I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.

I wasn't aware of this issue. I have reported it as well and will follow

up once I hear something.

Best Regards,

Jorge Garcia

Am 20.05.2016 um 20:32 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

SNIP

 

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

 

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

 

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore.

 

Well this has nothing to do with the bug report but I agree 100% what Olin

says about the latest eagle "developments".

IMHO it's a shame to declare  new blurry icons as new features, ah but

yes, they are scalable.

Same goes for the loud announcement of the "hierarchical design" which

is not half ready yet.

If someone tells me now that hierarchical design will be finished in

version 8 or9 then that's it with me and eagle after 25 years.

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Am 20.05.2016 um 20:32 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

SNIP

 

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

 

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

 

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore.

 

Well this has nothing to do with the bug report but I agree 100% what Olin

says about the latest eagle "developments".

IMHO it's a shame to declare  new blurry icons as new features, ah but

yes, they are scalable.

Same goes for the loud announcement of the "hierarchical design" which

is not half ready yet.

If someone tells me now that hierarchical design will be finished in

version 8 or9 then that's it with me and eagle after 25 years.

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Jorge Garcia wrote on Thu, 19 May 2016 11:16

It's been a while since I've heard from you. I've touched the subject

again.

Thanks.

Quote:

This isn't a case of gratuitous change, it's more of an unintended

consequence of upgrading our GUI libraries.

That's one of the drawbacks when you don't own all your code.  You are

beholden to those that maintain the low level libraries that you rely on.

When you go that route, you need a really really good suite of regression

tests.

If I remember right, you use QT for your GUI library.  I know nothing about

it, but surely there must be a parameter you pass that indicates the type

of image file you want them to create.

Quote:

Since we are discussing, EAGLE supports other image formats with

monochrome output. Is there another alternative that might better suite

your purposes? For example, GIF or PNG?

The tools I use don't support PNG.  While I could in theory update them to

yet another file format, this is not something I want to spend time on at

this point.

As far as I can tell, Eagle doesn't support GIF files.  My tools do

understand GIF files, and they could support either monochrome or gray

scale images efficiently and without loss, but Eagle won't create them.  I

just tried it again in version 7.6.  With a schematic window open, I do

FILE > EXPORT > IMAGE.  In that dialog I enter "\temp\a.gif" for the file

name and check "Monochrome".  Instead of create the file as entered,

"\temp\a.gif.png" gets created.  I haven't checked, but assuming that's a

PNG file, not a GIF.  The same thing goes for JPG.  You get a .jpg.png file

when you try.

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore. 

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Jorge Garcia wrote on Thu, 19 May 2016 11:16

It's been a while since I've heard from you. I've touched the subject

again.

Thanks.

Quote:

This isn't a case of gratuitous change, it's more of an unintended

consequence of upgrading our GUI libraries.

That's one of the drawbacks when you don't own all your code.  You are

beholden to those that maintain the low level libraries that you rely on.

When you go that route, you need a really really good suite of regression

tests.

If I remember right, you use QT for your GUI library.  I know nothing about

it, but surely there must be a parameter you pass that indicates the type

of image file you want them to create.

Quote:

Since we are discussing, EAGLE supports other image formats with

monochrome output. Is there another alternative that might better suite

your purposes? For example, GIF or PNG?

The tools I use don't support PNG.  While I could in theory update them to

yet another file format, this is not something I want to spend time on at

this point.

As far as I can tell, Eagle doesn't support GIF files.  My tools do

understand GIF files, and they could support either monochrome or gray

scale images efficiently and without loss, but Eagle won't create them.  I

just tried it again in version 7.6.  With a schematic window open, I do

FILE > EXPORT > IMAGE.  In that dialog I enter "\temp\a.gif" for the file

name and check "Monochrome".  Instead of create the file as entered,

"\temp\a.gif.png" gets created.  I haven't checked, but assuming that's a

PNG file, not a GIF.  The same thing goes for JPG.  You get a .jpg.png file

when you try.

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore. 

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

 

Once again, DON'T MAKE GRATUITOUS CHANGES.  You will inevitably break

something that someone has relied on.

 

Hi Olin,

It's been a while since I've heard from you. I've touched the subject

again. This isn't a case of gratuitous change, it's more of an

unintended consequence of upgrading our GUI libraries.

Since we are discussing, EAGLE supports other image formats with

monochrome output. Is there another alternative that might better suite

your purposes? For example, GIF or PNG?

hth,

Jorge Garcia

 

Once again, DON'T MAKE GRATUITOUS CHANGES.  You will inevitably break

something that someone has relied on.

 

Hi Olin,

It's been a while since I've heard from you. I've touched the subject

again. This isn't a case of gratuitous change, it's more of an

unintended consequence of upgrading our GUI libraries.

Since we are discussing, EAGLE supports other image formats with

monochrome output. Is there another alternative that might better suite

your purposes? For example, GIF or PNG?

hth,

Jorge Garcia

Am 01.06.2016 um 23:10 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

Too late now anyway, but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

I'm not using V7, but for what I can see

- They massively hardened the autorouter's usage for no reason.

- They broke some ULPs. They even decided to not give you a hint of why

it might not work, the ULPs just don't work.

- You can't switch assembly variants in the board editor any longer.

- They turned EAGLE into adware. (Hint: The guys assembling the

prototypes for me are using the freeware version)

Olin wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:10

Joop_ wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:06

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

 

Too late now anyway,

Your V7 key will also work with V6.

Olin wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:10

... but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

Graphics speed, for example when dragging the layout with the middle mouse

button (wheel) but this depends

on the hardware. The Eagle team is aware of this.

Also, with V6, allmost all ulp's work. With V7, many ulp's are broken

because of the new hierarchy option.

The sad thing about Eagle is, that when you need a certain feature, they

(the Cadsoft team) point you to

an ulp.

But when you complain about bugs in an ulp, they act like it's not a part

of Eagle.

It looks they don't test the ulp's which are installed by default when they

release a new version.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Am 01.06.2016 um 23:10 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

Joop_ wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:06

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

 

Too late now anyway, but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

 

Actual 6.6

because is has NO hierarchical structure (HS) that hardly works in

schematics and not at all in boards.

I'm not gonna pay for less than half of a new "feature" HS in  version 7

and  no one knows  when this will be working properly, perhaps in

version 8 or 9? Or will it ever?

I don't blame cadsoft for this kind of business because they are  not

the own boss anymore. If this business continues, in version 13 we might

have a new feature like "we have added another semicolon in the

description".

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Jorge Garcia wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 12:11

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to

the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things

that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in

7.6.

 

I wasn't aware of this issue. I have reported it as well and will

follow

up once I hear something.

That's just one of several similar ones that I picked off the top of my

head.

Also off the top of my head, there's another like this in the library

editor.  Alt-L,D and Alt-L,S get you to devices and symbols respectively.

However, Alt-L,P doesn't get you to packages.  That's because someone had

the brilliant idea to use P as the shortcut key to two different menu

entries, even though the menu isn't that long and a little bit of thought

would have allowed for unique keys for each entry.  This has been broken

for a while, since version 5 at least.

C'mon guys.  This stuff isn't hard, it just takes someone to actually care

about keyboard usability.  There are quite a number of such things all thru

Eagle, and my impression is that the list gets bigger every release.  Don't

get me started on the keyboard (un)usability of the auto-router, especially

the new interface.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Joop_ wrote on Wed, 01 June 2016 17:06

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

Too late now anyway, but what is it you think is better in 6.6 than 7?

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

Olin wrote on Fri, 20 May 2016 14:32

I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.

Try V6.60, in my experience, it's the best version so far.

--

Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.

I wasn't aware of this issue. I have reported it as well and will follow

up once I hear something.

Best Regards,

Jorge Garcia

Am 20.05.2016 um 20:32 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

SNIP

 

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

 

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

 

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore.

 

Well this has nothing to do with the bug report but I agree 100% what Olin

says about the latest eagle "developments".

IMHO it's a shame to declare  new blurry icons as new features, ah but

yes, they are scalable.

Same goes for the loud announcement of the "hierarchical design" which

is not half ready yet.

If someone tells me now that hierarchical design will be finished in

version 8 or9 then that's it with me and eagle after 25 years.

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Am 20.05.2016 um 20:32 schrieb Olin Lathrop:

SNIP

 

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

 

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

 

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore.

 

Well this has nothing to do with the bug report but I agree 100% what Olin

says about the latest eagle "developments".

IMHO it's a shame to declare  new blurry icons as new features, ah but

yes, they are scalable.

Same goes for the loud announcement of the "hierarchical design" which

is not half ready yet.

If someone tells me now that hierarchical design will be finished in

version 8 or9 then that's it with me and eagle after 25 years.

--

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag

Jorge Garcia wrote on Thu, 19 May 2016 11:16

It's been a while since I've heard from you. I've touched the subject

again.

Thanks.

Quote:

This isn't a case of gratuitous change, it's more of an unintended

consequence of upgrading our GUI libraries.

That's one of the drawbacks when you don't own all your code.  You are

beholden to those that maintain the low level libraries that you rely on.

When you go that route, you need a really really good suite of regression

tests.

If I remember right, you use QT for your GUI library.  I know nothing about

it, but surely there must be a parameter you pass that indicates the type

of image file you want them to create.

Quote:

Since we are discussing, EAGLE supports other image formats with

monochrome output. Is there another alternative that might better suite

your purposes? For example, GIF or PNG?

The tools I use don't support PNG.  While I could in theory update them to

yet another file format, this is not something I want to spend time on at

this point.

As far as I can tell, Eagle doesn't support GIF files.  My tools do

understand GIF files, and they could support either monochrome or gray

scale images efficiently and without loss, but Eagle won't create them.  I

just tried it again in version 7.6.  With a schematic window open, I do

FILE > EXPORT > IMAGE.  In that dialog I enter "\temp\a.gif" for the file

name and check "Monochrome".  Instead of create the file as entered,

"\temp\a.gif.png" gets created.  I haven't checked, but assuming that's a

PNG file, not a GIF.  The same thing goes for JPG.  You get a .jpg.png file

when you try.

By the way, The FILE > EXPORT menu still won't accept "I" to go to the

"image" entry, as it did in version 5.  A number of similar things that

broke from version 5 to 7 (I never used 6) are still broken in 7.6.  It

seems that every version the user interface gets more tedius, requiring

either more keys, or much worse, forcing the use of the mouse.  I don't

know your process, but it feels on this end like nobody checks these

things.  You need someone using only the keyboard to follow a proper

regression test that hits all menus, popups, and the like.  One of the

great things about Eagle is that you can do most things with the keyboard,

but that advantage is eroding with every new release.  It used to be

something you paid attention to, but recent releases have been

disappointing.

Instead of creating a new version and adding new features, fix all the

little things that are broken first.  I know you make money by bringing out

new major versions, but you have to give the existing customers good value

too.  I'm not sure what I really got out of going from version 5 to 7.  I

did that because I got a customer to get me Eagle for my use at their site.

That of course had to be the latest version, which was 7.  I did upgrade

from 5 to 7 at Embed, mostly so I could move libraries back and forth and

not have to re-invent new parts.

What did I get for that?  The binary versus XML file format under the hood

is irrelevant to me.  The hierarchical schematics is a nice idea, but not

really ready yet.  The autorouter is now more complicated with that silly

top router that doesn't solve anything for any real EE I know of, and a

bunch of the user interactions are now much worse.  Can I get the ver 5

autorouter interface back, please?  After enough confusion, many more

keystrokes and very annoying clickety-click interactions I eventually get

it to do what it did much more easily before, but I don't see any advantage

at all.  Your existing loyal customers deserve more than the 5-7 delta for

the price of two upgrades.  It seems lately you're too focused on the

window dressing and appealing to stupid people so that you're not adding

real value each release anymore. 

--

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