element14 Community
element14 Community
    Register Log In
  • Site
  • Search
  • Log In Register
  • Community Hub
    Community Hub
    • What's New on element14
    • Feedback and Support
    • Benefits of Membership
    • Personal Blogs
    • Members Area
    • Achievement Levels
  • Learn
    Learn
    • Ask an Expert
    • eBooks
    • element14 presents
    • Learning Center
    • Tech Spotlight
    • STEM Academy
    • Webinars, Training and Events
    • Learning Groups
  • Technologies
    Technologies
    • 3D Printing
    • FPGA
    • Industrial Automation
    • Internet of Things
    • Power & Energy
    • Sensors
    • Technology Groups
  • Challenges & Projects
    Challenges & Projects
    • Design Challenges
    • element14 presents Projects
    • Project14
    • Arduino Projects
    • Raspberry Pi Projects
    • Project Groups
  • Products
    Products
    • Arduino
    • Avnet & Tria Boards Community
    • Dev Tools
    • Manufacturers
    • Multicomp Pro
    • Product Groups
    • Raspberry Pi
    • RoadTests & Reviews
  • About Us
    About the element14 Community
  • Store
    Store
    • Visit Your Store
    • Choose another store...
      • Europe
      •  Austria (German)
      •  Belgium (Dutch, French)
      •  Bulgaria (Bulgarian)
      •  Czech Republic (Czech)
      •  Denmark (Danish)
      •  Estonia (Estonian)
      •  Finland (Finnish)
      •  France (French)
      •  Germany (German)
      •  Hungary (Hungarian)
      •  Ireland
      •  Israel
      •  Italy (Italian)
      •  Latvia (Latvian)
      •  
      •  Lithuania (Lithuanian)
      •  Netherlands (Dutch)
      •  Norway (Norwegian)
      •  Poland (Polish)
      •  Portugal (Portuguese)
      •  Romania (Romanian)
      •  Russia (Russian)
      •  Slovakia (Slovak)
      •  Slovenia (Slovenian)
      •  Spain (Spanish)
      •  Sweden (Swedish)
      •  Switzerland(German, French)
      •  Turkey (Turkish)
      •  United Kingdom
      • Asia Pacific
      •  Australia
      •  China
      •  Hong Kong
      •  India
      •  Japan
      •  Korea (Korean)
      •  Malaysia
      •  New Zealand
      •  Philippines
      •  Singapore
      •  Taiwan
      •  Thailand (Thai)
      •  Vietnam
      • Americas
      •  Brazil (Portuguese)
      •  Canada
      •  Mexico (Spanish)
      •  United States
      Can't find the country/region you're looking for? Visit our export site or find a local distributor.
  • Translate
  • Profile
  • Settings
Autodesk EAGLE
  • Products
  • More
Autodesk EAGLE
EAGLE User Support (English) EAGLE GUI (7): Unnerving failure behaviour
  • Blog
  • Forum
  • Documents
  • Events
  • Polls
  • Files
  • Members
  • Mentions
  • Sub-Groups
  • Tags
  • More
  • Cancel
  • New
Join Autodesk EAGLE to participate - click to join for free!
Actions
  • Share
  • More
  • Cancel
Forum Thread Details
  • Replies 0 replies
  • Subscribers 187 subscribers
  • Views 176 views
  • Users 0 members are here
Related

EAGLE GUI (7): Unnerving failure behaviour

e14 Contributor
e14 Contributor over 14 years ago

Remember the bad old MS-DOS times? When strange programs like the Norton

Commander were considered state-of-the-art? Oh my. The worst thing in

those times was the behaviour of more or less ANY program in case

something went WRONG: You either got a crash, or things were completely

screwed up, or things began to get REALLY complicated.

 

Take file copying, for instance: Copying a file to another location was

a breeze even then, but what happened if the file already existed in the

destination folder? You got the message 'File already exists. Overwrite

it?' Well, what the heck, I don't know! Did I make an error and want to

overwrite a newer version with an older one? Or what? No other file

information was shown, the user couldn't decide and had to cancel the

whole process, check manually and try again. Frustrating.

 

Some years later, the Windows File Manager started to ask the SAME

question, but displayed CRUCIAL file information (date, time, size)

about source and destination, so that the user could decide properly.

MUCH better. Thank you.

 

In the meantime, nearly all sensible programs have an at least halfways

decent failure behaviour, but, unfortunately, EAGLE at points is NOT one

of them. In case of failure, it just cancels the operation and leaves

the user in the rain. At other points, a warning COULD be displayed, but

isn't. Examples:

 

  1. Renaming NETS:

     The user wants to rename a net and types in the new desired name

     in the corresponding NAME dialog box. BUT the name already exists.

     EAGLE, being clever, warns the user: 'Do you want to connect these

     nets?' This question is IMPORTANT and, it's THERE. Wonderful. The

     user selects 'No', because he doesn't want to create short-circuits,

     and voila! That's it. All dialogs have closed. Hey, there was a

     REASON why the user wanted to rename that net. He just mistyped.

     Now he just has to start the renaming again and type in the desired

     name AGAIN (this time without a typo, hopefully).

     It would be nicer if selecting 'No' would NOT cancel the whole

     renaming, but just go back to the rename dialog, so the user could

     CHANGE things instead of doing EVERYTHING once again.

  2. Renaming PARTS:

     The user got a circuit from someone else, where a resistor was

     NAMED 'shunt'. This needs to be renamed to 'R' something, so that

     the resistor is correctly sorted into the bill of materials. The

     user renames the part 'R10', but gets the error message 'R10

     already exists'. Boing, that's the end again. He has to start

     the renaming again.

  3. Renaming NETS (again):

     The user renames a net to 'A,B'. Everything is done without

     problems. SOUNDS nice. The only problem appears LATER, when the

     user tries to include this net into a bus: The bus uses the

     comma as net SEPARATOR, so it seems to be IMPOSSIBLE to include

     the net 'A,B' into this bus. I tried. It didn't work. Does anyone

     know a way around that? I haven't found one. Neither ''' nor

     '"' worked. Therefore, net names MAY contain a comma, but that

     might be a PROBLEM later on. The user should be informed about

     this when renaming.

  4. Renaming PARTS (again):

     A new EAGLE user added several connectors and now wants to equip

     them with descriptive texts like 'INPUT1', 'OUTPUT1', 'INPUT2',

     etc. He uses the NAME command to do that. Everything works as

     expected, and the texts appear properly. The only problem is that

     one should NOT use NAME for that, but VALUE. This is a typical

     error made by >80% of all new users (at least in our institute).

     It's not BAD, of course, but the BOM is then completely screwed

     up. Therefore, there SHOULD be some sort of warning if the user

     tries to do that.

 

Of course, (1) and (2) can be implemented quite easily, and there's no

harm in doing that, but what about (3) and (4)? Errors like that can

surely happen with NEW users, but what about the experts? They KNOW how

to do things, and they surely do NOT like to click away thousands of

unnecessary warnings. If they WANT to rename such things, they want to

do that WITHOUT warning.

 

That's where a (relatively new - only 10 years old) GUI invention comes

in handy: The warning with 'Don't show this message again' checkbox in

it. This is SO WONDERFUL! This way, newbies can get their warning to

bring them on the right path and prevent them from unknowingly doing

harmful things, ans as soon as they KNOW not to do this again, they can

remove that message forever.

 

Examples:

  5. For (3), the warning could read 'Net names containing a comma

     prevent them from being included in a bus. Do you want to

     keep the new name?' YES renames, NO goes BACK TO THE RENAME DIALOG,

     CANCEL cancels the renaming. And the 'Don't show this message

     again' checkbox is there to throw the whole thing away or not.

  6. For (4), the algorithm could be: If the first name characters

     are NOT the device's prefix, or if this is NOT followed by an

     integer number, then show the warning 'If a component's name

     does not include its prefix and a number, it might be wrongly

     sorted into the bill of material. Do you want to keep the new

     name?' Behaviour as mentioned above.

 

At SOME point in the GUI, there should be an option to reset all of

these 'Don't show anymore' flags to their 'the user wants to see me'

default.

 

Anyway, try

  - take to MOST PROBABLE action in case of problems (and don't

    always automatically cancel it) and

  - try to prevent often-made errors with warnings that can be

    clicked away forever.

 

The MOST common mistakes new EAGLE users make (and which could be caught

by an algorithm) are the following:

  - Closing ONE window and continuing work, screwing up the whole

    design (already partly solved by the F/B annotation warning).

  - Using a grid other than 0.1" in the schematics.

  - Using WIRE instead of NET to create electrical connections in

    the schematic.

  - MOVING existing nets to create electrical connections. That

    LOOKS connected, but just doesn't work at all.

  - Using a board grid that is different from 0.1" (or continued

    halfening of it).

  - Placing electrically unconnected board wires over electrically

    connected ones (to do 45 degree things and track widening),

    resulting in DRC errors.

  - RENAMING components instead of setting their values (as seen

    above).

  - [The 'comma in net' problem of course is NOT common, but it

    could be intercepted as easily]

And yes, experts might want to do all of these things, but the NEW user

should be warned accordingly...

 

Andreas Weidner

 

  • Sign in to reply
  • Cancel
element14 Community

element14 is the first online community specifically for engineers. Connect with your peers and get expert answers to your questions.

  • Members
  • Learn
  • Technologies
  • Challenges & Projects
  • Products
  • Store
  • About Us
  • Feedback & Support
  • FAQs
  • Terms of Use
  • Privacy Policy
  • Legal and Copyright Notices
  • Sitemap
  • Cookies

An Avnet Company © 2026 Premier Farnell Limited. All Rights Reserved.

Premier Farnell Ltd, registered in England and Wales (no 00876412), registered office: Farnell House, Forge Lane, Leeds LS12 2NE.

Follow element14

  • X
  • Facebook
  • linkedin
  • YouTube