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substitute ic HD3111 used in organ

acdc90
acdc90 1 month ago

Hello 

this is used in Yamaha BK20A1 organ made in 70s by hitachi

16 pin package using a sandwich of 2 pieces of ceramic, 

the circuit shows power rail of -9 and -26v

and describes it as 6 dividers in 1 package

looking at some organ forums say lm3211 but i dont agree 

can anyone find a replacement or should  i just make some flip flop circuits

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  • genebren
    genebren 1 month ago in reply to genebren +2
    In looking further in the limited set of Hitachi parts that found, the HD31xx parts are MOS devices, Here is a screen shot of a HD3107 from Hitachi: They are showing VGG values of 24V +/- 10% and VDD…
  • beacon_dave
    beacon_dave 1 month ago in reply to genebren +2
    There are some more data sheets from the HD3100 series here: https://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/t-hitachihd31xxdata.html Also UTsource describes it as "HD3111 is a high-speed, low-power, high-performance…
  • Jan Cumps
    Jan Cumps 1 month ago in reply to shabaz +1
    It may be a linear / analogue divider.
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  • shabaz
    0 shabaz 1 month ago

    I saw a circuit diagram for a different Yamaha organ online:

    image

    From that, it looks like just six independent divide-by-2 instances inside each chip. 

    You'd need to measure the voltage at the input, to see if the signals are 5V logic, or something completely different. 

    You could use three 74HC74 ICs, which are dual D-type flip-flops which can be configured to divide by 2. You'd need output circuitry (either transistors., or even op-amps) to level shift because there's a fair chance the levels might not be anything normal.

    In summary if one of these ICs is faulty then you'll likely need a custom adapter PCB made up with the circuitry mentioned.

    You could use programmable logic, but I don't think it will save much space, since you still will need the output driver circuitry to level-shift.

    I doubt there's any non-obsolete second-source for this obscure IC, because there's just no requirement for such functionality nowadays.

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  • genebren
    0 genebren 1 month ago in reply to shabaz

    You might be right! I found a photocopy of an old hitachi data book which had some HD31xx parts (but not 3111) and some of the close numbers were quad flip-flops and other logic gates.

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  • genebren
    0 genebren 1 month ago in reply to genebren

    In looking further in the limited set of Hitachi parts that found, the HD31xx parts are MOS devices, Here is a screen shot of a HD3107 from Hitachi:

    image

    They are showing VGG values of 24V +/- 10% and VDD values 14V +/- 10%, so these are in the ballpark of what you are seeing.

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  • beacon_dave
    0 beacon_dave 1 month ago in reply to genebren

    There are some more data sheets from the HD3100 series here:

    https://www.oldcalculatormuseum.com/t-hitachihd31xxdata.html

    Also UTsource describes it as "HD3111 is a high-speed, low-power, high-performance CMOS logic device manufactured by Hitachi. It is a dual 4-input NAND gate."

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  • genebren
    0 genebren 30 days ago in reply to beacon_dave

    Yeah, that is the same source that I had found.

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  • genebren
    0 genebren 30 days ago in reply to beacon_dave

    Yeah, that is the same source that I had found.

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