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Member's Forum Does anyone know of a good circuit design to demonstrate echo on voice communications?
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Does anyone know of a good circuit design to demonstrate echo on voice communications?

rad_bcit
rad_bcit over 2 years ago

Many years ago, one of the things that attracted me into taking telecommunications training was a demo illustrating the effects of echo on a person’s ability to communicate over a telephone.

The user picked up a plain old telephone handset and attempted to speak and, as with most telephones, as portion of the voice signal from the transmitter/mouthpiece was echoed back as “sidetone” via the receiver/earpiece. At some settings of the device, I found it very difficult to speak because of the echo.

A snippet from https://getvoip.com/blog/phone-echoing/ (Rebecca Drew) explains the effect I experienced:

Echoing interferes with our understanding of another person’s voice in a phone call, and it confuses a person who is speaking because they hear themselves on the line. The problem is the delay between the spoken word in the outbound call stream and its reflection in the return stream. …

If the delay is less than 25 milliseconds, it’s almost undetectable. If the delay is around 55 milliseconds, the user experience is similar to having 2 people saying the same thing at the same time (a chorus-like effect). This level of echo or delay, though noticeable, is tolerable.

Once a delay increases beyond 55 milliseconds it becomes very annoying and distracting to users. At this point, it becomes nearly impossible to carry on a conversation. For a normal user, the echo of their own voice will essentially break down the call by interrupting their thought process.

My hope is that I can reproduce this fascinating demo for use in student recruiting events.

Does anyone have any ideas, circuit diagrams, or resources that would help me get this done?

I don’t have a large budget, but I have access to many tools and electronics components to get this done from scratch. However, I also think a black box modifying a prebuilt device such as a musician’s effects pedal such as the MXR Carbon Copy, would do the job, making more efficient use of the limited amount of time I have available.

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  • beacon_dave
    beacon_dave over 2 years ago +2
    You just need a microphone, an audio delay and some headphones. You can get the same effect with in ear monitors if the delay from your microphone through the mixer back to the in ear monitors goes beyond…
  • rad_bcit
    rad_bcit over 2 years ago in reply to beacon_dave +2
    Thanks for the reply, beacon_dave. Your suggestion of video has given me another idea. Perhaps I could show the same video image on multiple systems, each displaying a different amount of pixelation…
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 2 years ago in reply to rad_bcit +2
    Great! If you get stuck feel free to ask, I'm sure eventually one of us will figure it out. It's definitely an interesting topic. I recall talking to an ex audio-engineer once, he mentioned that in…
Parents
  • robogary
    0 robogary over 2 years ago

    The PT2399 is what you are looking for. They are a ton of fun, audio reverb, echo, etc... I built a PT2399 project for taking to STEM nights at elementary schools. It uses an electret mike hot glued into a PVC pipe for a microphone. The kids can spit, drip, lick, sneeze, whatever, and it costs a few cents to toss it, and use a new one. Tied in with a LM386 , the kids love to shout "HELP!!!!" in it like they are lost in a cave. Use a pot, or several pots to vary the output.

    https://www.futurlec.com/Others/PT2399.shtml

    I've also used them with a HT8950 for a robot voice modulator  www.sparkfun.com/.../10574

    Google the PT2399, you'll find a ton more projects done with them.

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  • rad_bcit
    0 rad_bcit over 2 years ago in reply to robogary

    Hi Robogary,

    This is very close to what I'm looking for, except that is is a digital solution, not an analog one. If I decide to go the "black box" route, it unlikely anyone else will know.

    I see that the PT2399 is available on inexpensive boards marketed as karaoke reverberation devices.

    I found a good write-up on the PT2399 on Electrosmash https://www.electrosmash.com/pt2399-analysis

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  • rad_bcit
    0 rad_bcit over 2 years ago in reply to robogary

    Hi Robogary,

    This is very close to what I'm looking for, except that is is a digital solution, not an analog one. If I decide to go the "black box" route, it unlikely anyone else will know.

    I see that the PT2399 is available on inexpensive boards marketed as karaoke reverberation devices.

    I found a good write-up on the PT2399 on Electrosmash https://www.electrosmash.com/pt2399-analysis

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  • beacon_dave
    0 beacon_dave over 2 years ago in reply to rad_bcit

    About 55 feet of pipe with a transducer at each end would keep it in the analogue domain.

    Or perhaps a magnetic tape delay.

    I think some of the old bucket brigade delay line ICs have been remanufactured.

    You could do POTS to VOIP then back to POTS again as VOIP will add a significant delay. 

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