e14 changes and updates

dougw said:

cstanton 

Hey doug!

dougw said:

So....how are things changing since Tariq left?

We have had changes in the team after we restructured. There has been a lot of work that needed to be picked up, processes put in place and documentation written that was not written. We are still going through this process.

dougw said:

Are there new personnel in the works?

Haven't you met Addy:  Hello! element14 Community Members or Jordan:  Hi everyone!? They joined the team recently. We are still hiring for a designer and video editor based out of our Bangalore office in India.

dougw said:

Are there changes to Project14 coming?

The political answer would be "There are no changes to Project14" to be " technically correct, " but I suspect your real question is "When is the next Project14 going to be?" I'll address this in a moment.

dougw said:

Are there changes to other programs?

They are currently reduced in number while we transition workloads, but we're still doing RoadTests, Webinars, Design Challenges, element14 presents, Tech Spotlights, Essentials, Quizzes, and thinking up new ideas.

dougw said:

Is there a schedule?

Was there ever a schedule? I believe we've never posted one to the site before. We are planning our activities for the next fiscal year, and we have not set in stone what we are working on yet, that includes Project14. We are also still onboarding the new staff, recently we resolved issues with shipping out prizes and managed to get the Project14 Time and Space prizes out of the door to the winners - which took up to a year before for some reason!? That should also answer your first question.

For me I come to this thinking "What's the most rewarding for our members? And what makes sense for the website?" for example, we currently keep creating groups to support different programmes and that saturates and dilutes navigating the website. I'd like to consolidate it all down a bit to support the same programmes but not get lost when navigating.

As always I appreciate the time and attentiveness given by our members to the Community and asking the engaging, difficult questions. We appreciate you.

Thanks for the update! I've only been "active" here for a handful of months, despite having an account since forever. The site's structure is definitely a bit intimidating and confusing, so it's good to hear that some consolidation efforts are happening. And visibility of all of the initiatives becomes a bit of an issue when there's so many sections. For example, I didn't even know about Project 14 until quite recently when someone mentioned it.
The more I browse this community the more I like it, but the site is not particularly easy to navigate, so I feel like I might be missing out on a bunch of cool stuff, and that I'm discovering them at a very slow pace.

battlecoder said:

cstanton I'm using a PC

Thanks.

battlecoder said:

The problem of empty sections could be solved if they only show up when there's content in them. For example it would be great if the ever-present "Documents" or "Files"  options  don't appear in menus or tabs if there are no Files or Documents associated to that group or section.

I think that this can go either way. The option kinda has to be there, so that you know there may be a 'document' or 'file' there at some point, and if it isn't there, you may not think to come back to know that it could be there.

These options relate to whether or not there is an 'application' in that group to allow for the type of content to be posted in it, so at present, if a group 'can' have blogs in it, it will at least have a 'blog' option, even if there are no blogs in it, else people won't be able to click into that blog application and click 'new' to add one. If it isn't there, you won't be able to add any content to it.

battlecoder said:

Maybe a website map would help (or maybe there's already one and I've not found it).

As beacon_dave posted, it's in the footer of the site.

battlecoder said:

Ironically that "sitemap" is more intuitively organized that the top menu. At least for me. Like...I think I could find content a lot easier using the sitemap section than the top menu, even when it's not the kind of map I was expecting.

You may end up with the opposite problem, people don't know where they want to go because there's too much information being presented at once. 

cstanton said:

These options relate to whether or not there is an 'application' in that group to allow for the type of content to be posted in it, so at present, if a group 'can' have blogs in it, it will at least have a 'blog' option, even if there are no blogs in it, else people won't be able to click into that blog application and click 'new' to add one. If it isn't there, you won't be able to add any content to it.

Well, you can always have those actions; add blog, add document, etc at the group/section level. They don't need to be in the tabs. I  think that if the sections don't appear when they are empty, I'd be more likely to notice when something was added, because the section will appear.

Alternatively, I guess, you could have a counter in the tab name. Something like "Documents (0)", "Blogs (5)", which could not only help avoid clicking on empty sections all the time, but would also inform when there's something new.
Just throwing ideas out there though. I'm a user of this platform and I've struggled navigating it, and part of the frustration comes from constantly clicking on empty sections or links that go to blank pages.

cstanton said:

You may end up with the opposite problem, people don't know where they want to go because there's too much information being presented at once.

If I'm specifically looking for, let's say, "Raspberry Pi", I can easily identify in the sitemap all the relevant sections and click on them. Even if I'm browsing for content that "looks interesting", it's still a lot easier to find if you can see a list of all the sections instead of going up and down a hierarchy of menus. So again, at least to me, the sitemap is a lot friendlier as a navigational tool than the current menu structure.
Having said that, the map has almost zero discoverability at the footer.

My criticism of the menu is, however, very small. I'm not saying that it's terrible. It's just not that intuitive, and it has taken me some amount of time to get used to its logic. The same with where the "actions" are located. Sometimes they are on the left side, sometimes they are on the right side. The first time that I encountered a section with actions on the right side I didn't notice them. Now I know that I have to look at both side bars to find the "actions" and I've not struggled with that ever since.

Since the Verint site was created, I've never seen the sitemap; first time! If that bottom-of-the-page sitemap is actually more usable, then it raises the question, what improvements should be made elsewhere, to make the site more acceptable, because it's not fair to expect people to discover a link right at the bottom of the page for better usability.

Also, in the sitemap, the granularity on the left side could do with tweaks. On the one had it (rightly I feel) lists all Project14 themes and Design Challenges, but on the other hand RoadTests is just a single line entry.

It would be good if the sitemap had menus so that if a user hovered over them, then the next level of detail would be shown. A bit like the Farnell product website basically. And then all the RoadTests could be displayed either in a scrolling menu, or all listed on a page, because there are thousands of them, and today there's no easy way to access them without knowing what to google for, or clicking "next" repeatedly and hope to find a product of interest. It's such a waste of content because people can't see it.

Also, in the main area of the page, it's very confusing that there is a 'Project' tab with just a couple of dozen items in it. Personally I feel it should be either back-filled with all projects, or it should be got rid of.  Currently one needs to be aware that just a few projects are there, and the remainder will have to be navigated to by other means. Newcomers won't know that, they will click on Projects and be majorly disappointed at the apparent lack of projects.

It’s harsh to say, but the site’s Information Architecture is really poor (I worked in this area professionally for a time.)  The response seems to come down to Verint software restricting the choices of E14 developers.  Verint isn’t fit-for-purpose for what they market it for when it comes to this type of site - although in the salesman’s eyes, fit-for-purpose = universal applicability.

Andrew J said:

The response seems to come down to Verint software restricting the choices of E14 developers.

I would say partly so, it's also a choice by the developers to not want to customise anything 'out of the box' (to make upgrading easier) and insists that Verint make the changes.

You may find it interesting to browse through the Verint Community forums.

Well it makes perfect sense to not customise the core functionality if there aren’t hooks to do that - I’m with them on that.  That doesn’t really change the point about the software not being a good match for this type of site.  Did the salesman throw in the shoe-horns ? Incidentally, I presume they use the software on their community forum?  How have they managed to default sort “by last post date” but it seems impossible to do here without creating a separate widget?  

Andrew J said:

That doesn’t really change the point about the software not being a good match for this type of site.  Did the salesman throw in the shoe-horns

If you look back through the archives, pre transition I seem to recall some community members actually suggesting/recommending this software for the new platform.

Perhaps also need to consider the alternative options that were available at the time. I don't recall there being a very long list.

beacon_dave said:

If

beacon_dave said:

If you look back through the archives, pre transition I seem to recall some community members actually suggesting/recommending this software for the new platform.

I take it they were led around the back and shot!  Were you involved in the selection process?

Andrew J said:

I presume they use the software on their community forum?  How have they managed to default sort “by last post date” but it seems impossible to do here without creating a separate widget?  

Have a look at it if you can

Andrew J said:

That doesn’t really change the point about the software not being a good match for this type of site

What software would you say is?

Verint is very much a like-for-like with Jive which we were using before.

To be fair I don't recall anyone stating the software was any good : ( I was certainly aware of Verint the firm (they make security products) but pretty sure I would have stated I'd never used their community platform, and was aware of zero features of it, i.e. it was up to element14 to do the evaluation. 

It's a pity the Jive version of the site was not viable any longer. Towards the end it was really pretty much perfect from a user experience.

To be fair I don't recall anyone stating the software was any good : ( I was certainly aware of Verint the firm (they make security products) but pretty sure I would have stated I'd never used their community platform, and was aware of zero features of it, i.e. it was up to element14 to do the evaluation. 

It's a pity the Jive version of the site was not viable any longer. Towards the end it was really pretty much perfect from a user experience.

shabaz said:

It's a pity the Jive version of the site was not viable any longer. Towards the end it was really pretty much perfect from a user experience.

Oh, it had its issues too, but it did have a lot of customisations. It would have been nice to be able to say "Sure, give us the source code, we'll support it ourselves and run it in-house" - I feel that has a 'here be dragons' caution around it. 

shabaz said:

To be fair I don't recall anyone stating the software was any good : (

Yup, just found that post... you're off the hook... 

I thought there were some posts from people that had used the Verint/Telligent platform before though. Perhaps that was only after the migration had started.

There didn't appear to be many alternatives suggested at the time though. No-one was exactly raving about platforms that were working well for other community sites, with similar functionality to Jive.

That would have been interesting! I've had to work with such software in the past, i.e. some other firm's source code, which I had to get up-to-speed with and self-support, but admittedly the firm continued to be paid for at least a year (maybe two) for a few hours support each week, plus they were responsible for bug-fixes for at least a few months from memory. We also used third party code that was fully supported, but we still occasionally self-fixed issues in it, until the supplier could supply their fix.

beacon_dave said:

There didn't appear to be many alternatives suggested at the time though

I kept winding up the community team/dev team by suggesting we use Discourse and Wordpress.

cstanton   That is hilarious!!!

Bet they loved that!  Is Drupal still a thing - that was all rage for a while.

Andrew J said:

Is Drupal still a thing

I believe it's up to version 11 now.

My radio club is using Drupal.  I think it's a nightmare.  Every platform is going to be imperfect.  If we accept that and learn to use what we have... we can move ahead.  But there are limits.