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EAGLE User Chat (English) Eagle v8 licensing...
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  • eagle
  • license
  • freeware
  • 8.0
Related

Eagle v8 licensing...

technolomaniac
technolomaniac over 8 years ago

Hi All --

 

Moving this to a separate thread so it doesn't get lost in the ether.  Here's my two cents on licensing and I'd love your feedback:

 

Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription and the EAGLE paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an account to retrieve your license entitlement.  Once you have this, you are good to go and the SW will run as expected.  If you lose your network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you to work offline for 14 days.  I know that some folks would prefer to never have to connect, but this is required to support a monthly subscription model that can be selectively enabled and disabled when you use the SW (so you only pay when you use it).  The total cost of ownership for those folks using it less than a few weeks a year will thus be substantially lower and still enables you to access the full software for less money.  <Insert revolt here>  image

 

WRT to "what happens if autodesk decides to one day just shut off the license server?" ...ok, sure, that's possible, but so is a reality TV star becoming President of the..cough...nevermind, bad example.

 

Point is, that's a pretty remote possibility (think: time travel and alien invasions) and it wouldn't benefit us *at all* to upset the users we just spent real money hoping to bring into autodesk and earn their business.  As the guy with both development and P&L for the product, I can tell you that it's counterintuitive and wouldn't benefit us at all.  We know this.  We make SW used by governments, movie studios, game developers, MEs, Civil Engineers, machinists, etc. and you can bet that shutting down a license server is not to our benefit in any of these categories.  To demonstrate this behavior in one category, without a path for user SW and data, calls into question ALL of our tools' viability under this model.  Not helpful.

 

Now...a question was raised about "but what if I drop my subscription and I want my data".  Awesome, the data is yours and lives on your machine.  And for SW that stores data in the cloud (we have some of these) we always provide a path to your data.  If this again fails with one product, it puts all of the others up for discussion.  Again, not helpful.  (Read:  strategy = doomed).

 

"So what about needing an entitlement for the freeware to open the data I created in another version (a *paid* version) and reading it?  What if I want access and I dont want the 14-day time out?"

 

So here's the deal...We can do better here.  So we will.  Here's my commitment to the group here for freeware that ensures you always have a license that you can fall back on without need of internet connection *except when you first install it* (which after all, you would have had to get it in the first place):  in version 8.1 or 8.0.1 or whathaveyou (let's call it 'a future release'), if you install the SW and authenticate once, we'll remove the timer req.  So what I'm saying another way is, the freeware will require you to login the first time to get your license, but if you log out beyond that, you're good.  You got your entitlement and you can use it freely without connection.

 

Caveat:  to install an update, you will need to login.  The update server (which issues the new version...e.g. 8.1 or 8.2. or 8.0.1, etc.) requires that you login and get the update, but beyond that, logout.  Thus if you want to go off-grid in a mountain cabin somewhere, get your license at Starbucks (blagh! I understand they have 'free' wifi, but no frappucinos!  ...that stuff is bad for you) then get your license and go on your merry way up to the snow drenched peaks.  When you hear from the other mountaineers or your local yodeler that a new version of EAGLE is available...download, login, get your license, get your 'decaf double-pump vanilla non-fat latte macchiato' and head back up the slopes.

 

Point being, we can do the freeware better.  So we will.

 

Hope this is clear.  Let us know if you have questions!

 

Best regards,

 

Matt Berggren

Director - Autodesk

@technolomaniac

hackaday.io/matt

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Top Replies

  • COMPACT
    COMPACT over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest +4
    Not to worry, it's back to the Drawing board for me.
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 8 years ago +3
    Hi Matt, When will the EAGLE Maker version (or another solution for hobbiests) be v8-ready? I see the subscription for 'EAGLE Standard' and 'EAGLE Premium' are now available on the website, but not EAGLE…
  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport +3
    Il 21/02/2017 22:54, Ed Robledo ha scritto: The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE. Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they were not done…
Parents
  • Joop14
    Joop14 over 8 years ago

    The only thing that autodesk has achieved so far with version 8.0 and 8.1,

    are instabilities, crashes and a couple of buggy additions (bga escape

    routing). It shows that the priorities of the software team has changed

    i.e. testing has become less important.

    Autodesk also shows that is doen't really care about what the customer

    want.

     

    I want to buy a license for V7 but autodesk don't let me because they know

    that people who already have

    a license for V7, will not "upgrade" to V8 and their subscription. So much

    for their confidence in their

    new product...

     

     

     

     

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

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  • techsupport
    techsupport over 8 years ago in reply to Joop14

    Joop14 wrote:

     

    The only thing that autodesk has achieved so far with version 8.0 and 8.1,

    are instabilities, crashes and a couple of buggy additions (bga escape

    routing). It shows that the priorities of the software team has changed

    i.e. testing has become less important.

    Autodesk also shows that is doen't really care about what the customer

    want.

     

    It is no uncommon for a brand new major release to have a some incidents or issues.  The difference is how fast does the developing team make the changes to solve it.  Autodesk did prove this when releasing an update to 8.0.1 which solved the majority of issues in less than 2 weeks. The latest implementation were based on improvements being requested by the users, there is no foundation indicating Autodesk doesn't care about the customer. The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE.  Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they were not done in the first place.

    Best Regards,

    Ed

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  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport

    Il 21/02/2017 22:20, techsupport ha scritto:

     

    The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE. 

    Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they

    were not done in the first place.

     

    Good! Said that, please, fix the license!

     

    Best regards

     

    Alberto

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  • techsupport
    techsupport over 8 years ago in reply to albertovignati

    The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE.

    Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they

    were not done in the first place.

     

    Good! Said that, please, fix the license!

    The license isn't broken, nothing to fix there.  The majority of users prefer a better designing experience and that's what the team will continue doing. 

    Best Regards,

    Ed

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  • drkirkby
    drkirkby over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport

    Ed Robledo wrote:

     

    The license isn't broken, nothing to fix there. The majority of users prefer a better designing experience and that's what the team will continue doing.

    Best Regards,

    Ed

     

    I would be interesting to see if you can create a genuinely useful enhancement for Eagle, that will get as much reaction around the world as the licensing change has. I first heard about it on the time-nuts mailing list

     

    * Time-nuts

    https://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=time-nuts@febo.com&q=subject:%22Re\%3A+\[time\-nuts\]+OT\%3A+Eagle+PC+CAD+now+Auto…

     

    * Hackaday

    Autodesk Moves EAGLE to Subscription Only Pricing | Hackaday

     

    * Kicad

    https://forum.kicad.info/t/autodesk-kills-the-golden-eagle/4964

     

    * Altium

    Switch from Eagle PCB

     

    Would incorporating a full 3D EM solver, create as much interest on so many forums? I suspect not.

     

    There does not appear to be any fall in the Autodesk share price - in fact, it is almost as high as it has ever been. So I guess shareholders are not objecting.

     

    Dave

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  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport

    Il 21/02/2017 22:54, Ed Robledo ha scritto:

    The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE.

    Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they

    were not done in the first place.

     

    Good! Said that, please, fix the license!

    The license isn't broken, nothing to fix there.  The majority of users prefer a better designing experience and that's what the team will continue doing.

    Best Regards,

    Ed

     

    Mmmhhhh....

     

    Is seems that 90% of posts in this formum are related to the licence

    model instead other topics, this means that:

     

    1) The license is a concern;

    2) Users (me too) are asking you to review the license model.

     

    I just said I am a long term user (schematiclayoutautorouter pro), I

    just said that I had planned to upgrade to V8, I just said that I

    dropped it due the new license model.

    In my decision schema your license model enters as a FALSE in a final

    logic AND, so the definitive decision is always FALSE: not upgrade! This

    despite the features you plan to add and also the price.

    Again, I can accept a yearly maintenance model, I can not accept a

    subscription model. Maybe the only valid reason that Autodesk understand

    is the revenue instead users requests like this...

    I am not in a hurry, so I can wait and evaluating alternatives for the

    next months, maybe an year, then, if nothing changes, I have to say

    goodbye and good luck.

    I am angry, very angry, because I invested time and efforts (libraries,

    ULPs and so on) and I will have to rebuild all in another tool. Eagle is

    not a new product build from scratch, there is a users, like me, base

    who have choosen it for the feature but also for the license: to buy an

    existing company/product and to change policies at this level is like to

    be an elephant and to enter in a glassware... It is legal, but it is

    also absolutely unfair.

    So, in my perspective, license is broken and makes the product unusable.

     

    Best regards

     

    Alberto

     

     

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to drkirkby

    David Kirkby wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:49

    • Altium

    Switch from Eagle PCB

    (http://www.altium.com/eagle-switch/circuitstudio/)

     

    I just found out that Circuit Studio maintenance costs $150 a year.  With

    the current promotion, that makes it $5 cheaper than EAGLE Premium the

    first year, but then $350 cheaper than EAGLE every year after that.  Even

    without the promotional pricing, the break-even point is just over two

    years.  32 layers, unlimited board size, perpetual license, cheaper than

    EAGLE.  What's not to like?

     

    Quote:

    There does not appear to be any fall in the Autodesk share price - in

    fact, it is almost as high as it has ever been. So I guess shareholders

    are not objecting.

     

    Shareholders usually know nothing of the customer; many only look at the

    reports generated by a company itself...

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

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  • geralds
    geralds over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest


    Hi,

     

    Yes i calculated this too last month.

    Best Regards,

    Gerald

    ---

    I just found out that Circuit Studio maintenance costs $150 a year.  With

    the current promotion, that makes it $5 cheaper than EAGLE Premium the

    first year, but then $350 cheaper than EAGLE every year after that.  Even

    without the promotional pricing, the break-even point is just over two

    years.  32 layers, unlimited board size, perpetual license, cheaper than

    EAGLE.  What's not to like?

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport

    On 21.02.2017 22:54, Ed Robledo wrote:

     

    The license isn't broken, nothing to fix there.

     

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Ah wait.... Democracy has issues in the US recently...

     

    Markus

     

     

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  • rbtx99
    rbtx99 over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Why? Autodesk don't need to use only one or the other. You can have both licensing models at the same time and if someone is willing to take the risk with the online activation license... good luck to him.

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Reply
  • rbtx99
    rbtx99 over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Why? Autodesk don't need to use only one or the other. You can have both licensing models at the same time and if someone is willing to take the risk with the online activation license... good luck to him.

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Children
  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rbtx99

    On 23.02.2017 00:41, rbtx99 wrote:

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Why? You don't need to chose one or the other. You can have both licensing models at the same time and if someone is willing to take the risk with the online activation license... good luck to him.

     

     

    I guess supporting both models has some bad drawbacks. Autodesk would

    have to maintain every version up to each customers level, and there is

    no way they can handle revisions of all the old versions. I think

    autodesk wants a flat version model, where all the focus goes into the

    next common release, and those who pay get to play.

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rbtx99

    On 23.02.2017 00:41, rbtx99 wrote:

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Why? You don't need to chose one or the other.

     

    Just to have statistics. To see that you piss off  percent of the users right now. And to think about it when you see

    the actual figures.

     

    Markus

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rbtx99

    On 23.02.2017 00:41, rbtx99 wrote:

    It is. Make a poll on the Autodesk Website which license model the

    customer wants and provide the license model according to poll result.

     

    Why? You don't need to chose one or the other.

     

    Just to have statistics. To see that you piss off  percent of the users right now. And to think about it when you see

    the actual figures.

     

    Markus

     

     

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