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Auto-place, or at least "semi-automatic"

autodeskguest

Hello,

 

In the spirit of the Thanksgiving holiday tomorrow first of all a major

thank-you to Cadsoft for introducing a hierarchical schematic sheet

structure. This will hopefully bring Eagle more into the mainstream and

it was "the" reason why I bought V7 (I was a V4 hold-out).

 

Since Eagle does not have an auto-place routine and Jorge Garcia said in

another forum that there aren't any really suitable algorithms for that

I have a suggestion for a simpler fix:

 

When switching to board view for the first time let Eagle scatter the

components the same way they are on the schematic, with multiple pages

in sub-groups. It's ok if that occupies a large area because people will

then be able to concentrate on one stage at a time, drag that over as a

group and arrange the parts as need. Then the next cluster. And so on.

 

Right now Eagle just plops the parts down in a willy-nilly fashion. It

looks like neat rows but the designators are all mixed up, the ratsnest

is a mess. This lengthens the placement job because one has to search

for many parts.

 

Also, I strongly suggest to let the "lesser versions" such as Eagle

Standard pre-group clusters outside the board area just to get a grasp

of what belongs together. Right now it refuses with an error message

"objects outside allowed board area". You cannot move one little thing

unless you move it into the board area. You can't even move it back out

if you grabbed the wrong part. Just let people arrange parts outside the

board area wherever they want but without routing permission. That will

uphold the license limitations because they can only route after the

affected parts have been moved inside the board area.

 

--

Regards, Joerg

 

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

 

Parents

  • Joerg wrote on Wed, 26 November 2014 20:02

    When switching to board view for the first time let Eagle scatter the

    components the same way they are on the schematic, with multiple pages

    in sub-groups.

     

    I don't see any point to this.  The initial placement outside the board

    area is irrelevant, so  code to arrange it any particular way would be a

    waste of effort.

     

    Auto-placement algorithms don't really work with current technology.

    You're going to place every component manually anyway.  It doesn't matter

    where it comes from outside the board area when you bring it into the board

    area to place it.  You would typically be zoomed in to the area of the

    board you are working on, or at least zoomed to just the board if the board

    is small.  Parts you bring in to place will come from off screen someplace

    no matter how they are arranged out there.  It makes no difference where

    off screen that is.

     

    This is one of the few tasks where a paper printout is still useful.  After

    finishing the schematic, I print it out and put it on my desk.  As parts

    are placed, they are crossed off in the schematic.  When everything on a

    sheet is placed, the legend in the lower right corner is crossed off.  This

    process continues until everything is crossed off, meaning all parts have

    been placed.  Note that nowhere in this process does it matter at all where

    the unplaced parts are, as long as they aren't on the board.

    --

    Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

     

Reply

  • Joerg wrote on Wed, 26 November 2014 20:02

    When switching to board view for the first time let Eagle scatter the

    components the same way they are on the schematic, with multiple pages

    in sub-groups.

     

    I don't see any point to this.  The initial placement outside the board

    area is irrelevant, so  code to arrange it any particular way would be a

    waste of effort.

     

    Auto-placement algorithms don't really work with current technology.

    You're going to place every component manually anyway.  It doesn't matter

    where it comes from outside the board area when you bring it into the board

    area to place it.  You would typically be zoomed in to the area of the

    board you are working on, or at least zoomed to just the board if the board

    is small.  Parts you bring in to place will come from off screen someplace

    no matter how they are arranged out there.  It makes no difference where

    off screen that is.

     

    This is one of the few tasks where a paper printout is still useful.  After

    finishing the schematic, I print it out and put it on my desk.  As parts

    are placed, they are crossed off in the schematic.  When everything on a

    sheet is placed, the legend in the lower right corner is crossed off.  This

    process continues until everything is crossed off, meaning all parts have

    been placed.  Note that nowhere in this process does it matter at all where

    the unplaced parts are, as long as they aren't on the board.

    --

    Web access to CadSoft support forums at www.eaglecentral.ca.  Where the CadSoft EAGLE community meets.

     

Children
  • in reply to autodeskguest

    Olin Lathrop wrote:

    Joerg wrote on Wed, 26 November 2014 20:02

    When switching to board view for the first time let Eagle scatter the

    components the same way they are on the schematic, with multiple pages

    in sub-groups.

     

    I don't see any point to this.  The initial placement outside the board

    area is irrelevant, so  code to arrange it any particular way would be a

    waste of effort.

     

     

    Not at all, it will make it much easier to find stuff.

     

     

    Auto-placement algorithms don't really work with current technology.

     

     

    So why do even lower cost CAD programs such as Diptrace have it and

    people use it?

     

     

    You're going to place every component manually anyway.  It doesn't matter

    where it comes from outside the board area when you bring it into the board

    area to place it.  You would typically be zoomed in to the area of the

    board you are working on, or at least zoomed to just the board if the board

    is small.

     

     

    And that's exactly the problem. You are constantly zooming in and out to

    locate parts, especially if you do not have super-duper monitor

    resolution combined with the eyes of an eagle (the real ones, soaring

    high in the sky and able to spot a mouse a quarter mile below them).

     

     

    ... Parts you bring in to place will come from off screen someplace

    no matter how they are arranged out there.  It makes no difference where

    off screen that is.

     

    This is one of the few tasks where a paper printout is still useful.  After

    finishing the schematic, I print it out and put it on my desk.  As parts

    are placed, they are crossed off in the schematic.  When everything on a

    sheet is placed, the legend in the lower right corner is crossed off.  This

    process continues until everything is crossed off, meaning all parts have

    been placed.  Note that nowhere in this process does it matter at all where

    the unplaced parts are, as long as they aren't on the board.

     

     

    That's how we did that at the beginning of my career, almost 30 years

    ago. I thought that in this day and age at least some auto-grouping

    can't be too much to ask.

     

    Imagine this process in a cramped coach class seat on a >10h

    international flight where your "work space" is the size of a letter A

    sheet and all you have is a netbook. I had four of those flights over

    the last couple of months.

     

    --

    Regards, Joerg

     

    http://www.analogconsultants.com/