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Forum Are there any adverse effects from isolating the AC power supply on my electronics bench?
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  • modification
  • bench
  • 120vac
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  • ac
  • isolation
  • conditioner
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Related

Are there any adverse effects from isolating the AC power supply on my electronics bench?

4ringfan
4ringfan over 10 years ago

jw0752 happened to show me an Ebay listing the other day and it was like feeding candy to a baby.  My dad, he can be such an enabler!  Hehe!  So, the long and short of it is that I have acquired this BEAST (a Powervar 12 Power conditioner) and I am planning to modify it so that I can isolate and supply power to my entire bench.  The Powervac 12 is capable of supplying 12Amps at 120VAC, so the only thing I was thinking that I needed to be concerned with was possibly exceeding the supply capabilities of the transformer -- however I find the possibility of drawing that much power quite remote. So...


Here are my primary questions:


  1. Is there any reason or side effect that would contradict hooking the entire bench on the isolated secondary side of a transformer?
  2. Are there other things that I should be concerned with safety wise or otherwise plan for?
  3. Modification suggestions?
  4. In general, is this a good or bad idea?


I haven't found too many articles that talk about this, but here are links to a few that I have looked at:


isolation transformer - Electronics Forums


RadiolaGuy.com : Sonny's Tech Tips


http://www.signaltransformer.com/sites/all/pdf/IsolationTransformers%20Increase%20Safety%20of%20Electronic%20Systems.pdf


isolation - Why are we not always isolating the mains supply? - Electrical Engineering Stack Exchange


I have read the following and I take it that I should not connect any of my test equipment to the isolation, only projects that I am working on. What about power supplies?  What is the take on this?:

 

"DO NOT plug your test equipment into the isolation transformer, just the radio. I've seen folks wire their isolation transformer to a plug strip with all their equipment plugged into it and wonder why their "scope's" ground lead went up in smoke when they connected it to the radio chassis. If all your equipment is plugged into the isolation transformer, then nothing is "isolated"! Only the radio (or television) under test should be plugged into the isolation transformer!"


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  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 10 years ago in reply to 4ringfan +3 suggested
    4ringfan I'm guessing you don't want to listen to your father's advise ... I'm sure he has been able to offer some good advise. Isolating transformers are really only designed to work with double insulated…
  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 10 years ago in reply to 4ringfan +2
    4ringfan Mike Let him buy a motorcycle .. he will anyway. While we don't have the same weather problems, I brought one just after I got my licence. In those days you weren't restricted to 250cc so I brought…
  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 10 years ago in reply to peterjcs23 +2
    @peterjcs23 I'm not sure I would agree with all your conclusions. While I'm sure the corporate world may place some other restrictions, this discussion is about what those 'unseen' risks might be, and…
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  • peterjcs23
    0 peterjcs23 over 10 years ago

    Hi Mike, why do you want to do this? Mains powered equipment needs an earth for safety and emc filters. Portable equipment Safety Transformers generally have a centre taped "isolated" secondary (i.e. not an auto-transformer) but the centre tap is earthed...Peter

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  • mcb1
    0 mcb1 over 10 years ago in reply to peterjcs23

    Portable equipment Safety Transformers generally have a centre taped "isolated" secondary (i.e. not an auto-transformer) but the centre tap is earthed...Peter

    Not sure I agree with that.

    The whole idea is to isolate it, so sticking an earth and making both phase and neutral at 57v wrt earth, doesn't seem right to me.

     

    http://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/17496/how-is-using-a-transformer-for-isolation-safer-than-directly-connecting-to-the-p

    It is interesting in this discussion about a SINGLE PIECE of equipment on a transformer....

     

    Mark

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  • peterjcs23
    0 peterjcs23 over 10 years ago in reply to mcb1

    There is a range of products based on the principle...

     

    http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/safety-site-transformers/2604288/

     

    Peter

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  • michaelkellett
    0 michaelkellett over 10 years ago in reply to mcb1

    I've never used isolating transformers and in general I think I would rather rely on an RCD for basic protection.

     

    I also try to avoid servicing old stuff but when I have to I check the basic mains connections (especially earth) first. My Dad taught me to keep one hand in my pocket while working with high voltage stuff - I still do if I'm connecting a meter probe to alive terminal.

     

    I think the question of things interacting with the isolation transformer is interesting and I can imagine situations where it would be a problem.

     

    I'm totally in agreement re. floating instrument earths - don't do it ever. I often isolate the DUT by running it from a battery or an isolated DC supply so I can't see that using an isolating transformer is much different in principle but I would do it on a case by case basis.

     

    If I did a lot of high voltage work I would buy a set of high voltage diff probes for the scope or consider an isolated scope (but they tend to be rather pricey and  a bit low spec).

     

    MK

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  • mcb1
    0 mcb1 over 10 years ago in reply to peterjcs23

    Peter

    Like I said I fail to see the point in simply reducing the voltage to +- 55v ac.

    55v ac will still kill you since its at full current.

     

    This has some interesting comments about not connecting the centre tap ...although I can't quite understand what they mean

    gadget.iom

    Paul can you throw any light on it ...

     

     

    Mark

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  • peterjcs23
    0 peterjcs23 over 10 years ago in reply to michaelkellett

    Yes, people often buy Rigol scopes for use at home, they sell a massive range of accessories including high voltage probes...

     

    You can read more about the RP1000D series on the accessories page here:

    http://www.rigol.eu/products/accessories/

     

    Keep one hand in your pocket, wear rubber boots! Good advice.

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  • peterjcs23
    0 peterjcs23 over 10 years ago in reply to mcb1

    there is plenty to read on the world wide web about electrical safety, this document was interesting

     

    http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDAQFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Felectrica…

     

    Peter

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  • peterjcs23
    0 peterjcs23 over 10 years ago in reply to mcb1

    there is plenty to read on the world wide web about electrical safety, this document was interesting

     

    http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDAQFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Felectrica…

     

    Peter

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