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Smart Drive motor as a motor 'and' as a generator?

Former Member

Hi

I am working on a project where I want to use a Smart Drive Motor (Found in Fisher and Paykel washing machines, and also in LG and Samsung machines) as a motor, and then as a generator.  The problem I am having is getting the motor to work.  It needs a motor controller, but I haven't found anything in a post or anywhere that provides a list of parts and schematic. I am hoping to have the capabiltiy within the system to switch between a motr and a generator.

Given my level of capability I would really like a start to end project description.

 

Does anyone know of such a description or is anyone able to help me out with building this project?

 

Thanks

 

Simon

  • 0 in reply to colecago

    Hi

    I have drawn up the schematic as I see it at this point.  Points to note are that the motor is in a 3-phase star configuration.  I have also drawn in a relay to allow to switch between the motor and generator wiring.  The hall sensors from the motor to the motor controller will also have a switch to disconnect them so that in generator mode the controller does not receive spurious signals.

     

    image

    I have also attached a drawing of the wiring of the motor as it is configured at the moment in regard to the coils. 

     

    image

     

    I would like to know what controller I would need to be able to run this.  (And perhaps it is the one in the link above suggested by Don, but this does seem like it manages more power than I have), and any additional detail with how to install control the controller would also be appreciated.

     

    Look forward to your comments.

  • 0

    Saturday night, prior commitments, but I will do my best to respond tomorrow.

     

    -Rabbit-

    (new month next morning)

  • 0 in reply to Former Member

    What is the motor rated at for current, power, voltage, etc?

  • 0 in reply to colecago

    Hi

    The info I have on the motor is as follows.

     

    Electric Supply

    Operating Voltage 220/240 V AC 50Hz

    Maximum Current 2.8 amps

     

    Motor

    Electronically commutated direct drive 3 Phase brushless DC Motor.

    Motor resistance

                                  Per Winding                    Phase to Phase

    Phase 1                    1.3 ohms @ 20degC          2.6 ohms @ 20 degC

    Phases 2 to 4            6.1 ohms @ 20 degC         12.2 ohms @ 20 degC

    Phases 5 and 6          16 ohms @ 20 degC          32 ohms @ 20 degC

     

     

    Below is a link that has the info on the motor.  It is the manual for the washing machine it comes from.  I also have a pdf that describes the same motor in relation to its use as a generator.  It doesn't seem to be available online anymore and I can't see where I attach files within the post, only images and links.  I can email it if it would help.

     

    Anyway, I hope the link to the motor manual helps. 

     

    http://www.eserviceinfo.com/downloadsm/60779/Fisher%20&%20Paykel_Several%20-%20MW%20GW%20etc.html

     

    I appreciate the help.

  • 0 in reply to Former Member

    I haven't time to go into all the details of this motor but it is seriously weird - quite possible just perfect for a washing machine but absolutely NOT your standard BLDC. For a traction/regen application you need a motor intended for the purpose where all the phases are the same - otherwise you will need to design a controller completely on your own ( there isn't a lot of stuff on the web to help you.).  Get  a normal BLDC motor and then you can use all the kits and design stuff (loads of it) on the web.

     

    I'm also worried by your earlier post where you refer to the wind turbine - are you hoping to keep the vehicle moving by extracting energy from it's passage through the air ?

     

    MK

  • 0 in reply to Former Member

    Simon

    There was very good article about using one of these in a cheaper chinese windmill.

    Apparently they need a bit of attention to improve their performance and reliability.

     

    It was in the June/July2008 of The Shed magazine http://www.theshedmag.co.nz

     

    Mark

  • 0 in reply to michaelkellett

    Hi Michael

    Thanks for your comments.  I am discovering that this is not an easy motor to run as a motor.  Fairly easy to run as a generator though. 

    Perhaps if I explain my scenario some more you will see why I want to stick with it.

    I am using this generator because of its shape and size.  I am building a demonstration model of a new transmission system that I have invented.  I want to be able to prove the invention works so I can move forward in seeking investors and going towards commercialisation.  I have already built the transmission system to fit this generator, and as I have tolerances of 3 mm in some places, I am sure you can appreciate that swapping the motor/generator at this stage is not an option I wish to consider.  At the time I chose the generator, I had not anticipated the difficulty involved in running it as a motor. 

    You needn't worry about me wanting to put a wind turbine on a car to power it. 'I ain't that daft'.  :-)

    The turbine reference is because that is what the transmission system is likely to be suited to.  The car comment was in relation to another comment about the motor swapping between motor and generator, as in a hybrid car.  But this is not going on a car.

    I do have an article that outlines much of what is needed, but they do not stipulate the motor controller needed, just an indication of the sort of controller I should use.  As mentioned before, this is not an area of technology I am very familiar with so I do not want to buy the wrong equipment and either find it is unsuitable, or underrated. 

     

    I look forward to any other info you can add to the discussion..

  • 0 in reply to mcb1

    Thanks Mark,

    It seems that edition is sold out.  Following up from my comments in the reply to Michael, do you think that the article is still relevant?

    Regards

     

    Simon

  • 0 in reply to Former Member

    Tried twice to post  a reply but got  a new and even dafter E14 error message - about   a better 404.

     

    I think it was the link it didn't like.

     

    How many power wires are thre coming from the coils of the motor.

     

     

    MK

  • 0

    It is possible to make a boat or car that goes into the wind using a Savonious turbine, I'm told.  No electricity needed.  Downwind performance isn't always that great, however.