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EAGLE User Chat (English) Eagle v8 licensing...
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  • eagle
  • license
  • freeware
  • 8.0
Related

Eagle v8 licensing...

technolomaniac
technolomaniac over 8 years ago

Hi All --

 

Moving this to a separate thread so it doesn't get lost in the ether.  Here's my two cents on licensing and I'd love your feedback:

 

Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription and the EAGLE paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an account to retrieve your license entitlement.  Once you have this, you are good to go and the SW will run as expected.  If you lose your network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you to work offline for 14 days.  I know that some folks would prefer to never have to connect, but this is required to support a monthly subscription model that can be selectively enabled and disabled when you use the SW (so you only pay when you use it).  The total cost of ownership for those folks using it less than a few weeks a year will thus be substantially lower and still enables you to access the full software for less money.  <Insert revolt here>  image

 

WRT to "what happens if autodesk decides to one day just shut off the license server?" ...ok, sure, that's possible, but so is a reality TV star becoming President of the..cough...nevermind, bad example.

 

Point is, that's a pretty remote possibility (think: time travel and alien invasions) and it wouldn't benefit us *at all* to upset the users we just spent real money hoping to bring into autodesk and earn their business.  As the guy with both development and P&L for the product, I can tell you that it's counterintuitive and wouldn't benefit us at all.  We know this.  We make SW used by governments, movie studios, game developers, MEs, Civil Engineers, machinists, etc. and you can bet that shutting down a license server is not to our benefit in any of these categories.  To demonstrate this behavior in one category, without a path for user SW and data, calls into question ALL of our tools' viability under this model.  Not helpful.

 

Now...a question was raised about "but what if I drop my subscription and I want my data".  Awesome, the data is yours and lives on your machine.  And for SW that stores data in the cloud (we have some of these) we always provide a path to your data.  If this again fails with one product, it puts all of the others up for discussion.  Again, not helpful.  (Read:  strategy = doomed).

 

"So what about needing an entitlement for the freeware to open the data I created in another version (a *paid* version) and reading it?  What if I want access and I dont want the 14-day time out?"

 

So here's the deal...We can do better here.  So we will.  Here's my commitment to the group here for freeware that ensures you always have a license that you can fall back on without need of internet connection *except when you first install it* (which after all, you would have had to get it in the first place):  in version 8.1 or 8.0.1 or whathaveyou (let's call it 'a future release'), if you install the SW and authenticate once, we'll remove the timer req.  So what I'm saying another way is, the freeware will require you to login the first time to get your license, but if you log out beyond that, you're good.  You got your entitlement and you can use it freely without connection.

 

Caveat:  to install an update, you will need to login.  The update server (which issues the new version...e.g. 8.1 or 8.2. or 8.0.1, etc.) requires that you login and get the update, but beyond that, logout.  Thus if you want to go off-grid in a mountain cabin somewhere, get your license at Starbucks (blagh! I understand they have 'free' wifi, but no frappucinos!  ...that stuff is bad for you) then get your license and go on your merry way up to the snow drenched peaks.  When you hear from the other mountaineers or your local yodeler that a new version of EAGLE is available...download, login, get your license, get your 'decaf double-pump vanilla non-fat latte macchiato' and head back up the slopes.

 

Point being, we can do the freeware better.  So we will.

 

Hope this is clear.  Let us know if you have questions!

 

Best regards,

 

Matt Berggren

Director - Autodesk

@technolomaniac

hackaday.io/matt

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Top Replies

  • COMPACT
    COMPACT over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest +4
    Not to worry, it's back to the Drawing board for me.
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 8 years ago +3
    Hi Matt, When will the EAGLE Maker version (or another solution for hobbiests) be v8-ready? I see the subscription for 'EAGLE Standard' and 'EAGLE Premium' are now available on the website, but not EAGLE…
  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport +3
    Il 21/02/2017 22:54, Ed Robledo ha scritto: The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE. Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they were not done…
  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to Joop14

    On 19.01.2017 11:58, Joop wrote:

    The old license system has been working fine for many years. There's

    absolutely NO REASON

    to change that. Anti-piracy motives are a joke. We will see how fast a

    pirated & patched copy will

    appear on the internet/torrents.

    As usual, the need for internet connection will bother legitimate users but

    will not stop piracy.

     

    That is 100% my opinion as well.

     

    • Cancel
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  • Joop14
    Joop14 over 8 years ago

    I believe Autodesk will not pump money into Cadsoft for one or two years

    without getting enough

    revenue. They will either change back to the old license management system

    or they will sell

    Cadsoft (which opens the opportunity for the new owner to change the

    licensing system as well).

     

    So, if most users don't take a subscription, the problem will resolve in

    the end.

    In the mean time use V6 or V7.

    (I already downloaded copies of V6 & V7 for all platforms in case Autodesk

    gets the brilliant

    idea to pull the plug of the ftp server)

     

     

     

     

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • techsupport
    techsupport over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Hi Glen,

    At this time the Sales team is offering an aggressive incentive for

    existing users.   Please contact lourdes.vasquez@autodesk.com, she will

    be able to inform you of the incentive program being made available.

    Best Regards,

    Ed

    edwin.robledo@autodesk.com

    Support

     

     

     

    On 01/19/2017 02:08 AM, Glenn Jones wrote:

    Hi Matt, so to be clear with V8 we are obtaining a new copy of the

    software based on subscription that has nothing to do with the previous

    versions we paid for or where those were installed and used as I don't

    see the words upgrade used anywhere.

     

    I am a licensee of Unity3D. They too have gone the subscription route.

    They offered existing PRO customers a 50% reduction in their yearly

    subscription cost with an option to renew at that same price for a

    second year.

     

    Will Autodesk be offering any incentives to keep their existing customers?

     

    Glenn

     

     

    On 1/18/2017 2:26 PM, Matt Berggren wrote:

    Hi All --

     

    Moving this to a separate thread so it doesn't get lost in the ether.

    Here's my two cents on licensing and I'd love your feedback:

     

    Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription and the EAGLE

    paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an

    account to retrieve your license entitlement.  Once you have this, you

    are good to go and the SW will run as expected.  If you lose your

    network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you

    to work offline for 14 days.  I know that some folks would prefer to

    never have to connect, but this is required to support a monthly

    subscription model that can be selectively enabled and disabled when

    you use the SW (so you only pay when you use it).  The total cost of

    ownership for those folks using it less than a few weeks a year will

    thus be substantially lower and still enables you to access the full

    software for less money.  <Insert revolt here>  image

     

    WRT to "what happens if autodesk decides to one day just shut off the

    license server?" ...ok, sure, that's possible, but so is a reality TV

    star becoming President of the..cough...nevermind, bad example.

     

    Point it, that's a pretty remote possibility (think: time travel and

    alien invasions) and it wouldn't benefit us at all to upset the

    users we just spent real money hoping to bring into autodesk and earn

    their business.  As the guy with both development and P&L for the

    product, I can tell you that it's counterintuitive and wouldn't

    benefit us at all.  We know this.  We make SW used by governments,

    movie studios, game developers, MEs, Civil Engineers, machinists, etc.

    and you can bet that shutting down a license server is not to our

    benefit in any of these categories.  To demonstrate this behavior in

    one category, without a path for user SW and data, calls into question

    ALL of our tools' viability under this model.  Not helpful.

     

    Now...a question was raised about "but what if I drop my subscription

    and I want my data".  Awesome, the data is yours and lives on your

    machine.  And for SW that stores data in the cloud (we have some of

    these) we always provide a path to your data.  If this again fails

    with one product, it puts all of the others up for discussion.  Again,

    not helpful.  (Read:  strategy = doomed).

     

    +"So what about needing an entitlement for the freeware to open the

    data I created in another version (a paid version) and reading it?

    What if I want access and I dont want the 14-day time out?"+

     

    So here's the deal...We can do better here.  So we will.  +Here's my

    commitment to the group here for freeware that ensures you always have

    a license that you can fall back on+ *without need of internet

    connection* except when you first install it (which after all, you

    would have had to get it in the first place):  *in version 8.1 or

    8.0.1 or whathaveyou (let's call it 'a future release'), if you

    install the SW and authenticate once, we'll remove the timer req. * So

    what I'm saying another way is, the freeware will require you to login

    the first time to get your license, but if you log out beyond that,

    you're good.  You got your entitlement and you can use it freely

    without connection.

     

    Caveat:  to install an update, you will need to login.  The update

    server (which issues the new version...e.g. 8.1 or 8.2. or 8.0.1,

    etc.) requires that you login and get the update, but beyond that,

    logout.  Thus if you want to go off-grid in a mountain cabin

    somewhere, get your license at Starbucks (blagh! I understand they

    have 'free' wifi, but no frappucinos!  ...that stuff is bad for you)

    then get your license and go on your merry way up to the snow drenched

    peaks.  When you hear from the other mountaineers or your local

    yodeler that a new version of EAGLE is available...download, login,

    get your license, get your 'decaf double-pump vanilla non-fat latte

    macchiato' and head back up the slopes.

     

    Point being, we can do the freeware better.  So we will.

     

    Hope this is clear.  Let us know if you have questions!

     

    Best regards,

     

    Matt Berggren

    Director - Autodesk

    @technolomaniac

    hackaday.io/matt

     

    --

    To view any images and attachments in this post, visit:

    https://www.element14.com/community/message/213345

     

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    On 19.01.2017 12:11, rachaelp wrote:

     

    I don't think it's all about anti piracy, it might be in part, but as you say no matter what you do somebody will manage to circumvent the licensing and pirate versions will become available. I think it's more about being able to offer the monthly subscription, with helps with lowering the bar to getting a paid copy of EAGLE, making it more accessible to more people, plus it evens out the revenue stream a little as rather than a large spike when a new version comes out followed by lower one off purchases, there will be a more constant income from monthly purchasers. That's probably not a significant issue for Autodesk as their revenues are huge across the whole business. I think it's more about making it more accessible. To me there isn't anything sinister about what they have done, I just wish / hope there can be some alterations to make it suit all users a little better.

     

    It can be implemented both. Installer asks for licensekey/installcode,

    if it gets one, everything works as before.

     

    If not, work as Viewer with a login option to activate the subscribable

    features.

     

    I don't see why this should not be possible to combine both worlds.

     

    Markus

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    On 19.01.2017 14:54, rachaelp wrote:

    Yes that's a valid point but I think Nokia and Blackberry were in a completely different situation to Autodesk.

     

    That doesn't matter. Fact is: it could happen. The remote possibility is

    enough.

     

    Markus

     

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  • techsupport
    techsupport over 8 years ago in reply to omega-5

    Hi Friedrich,

    At this time subscription volume licensing is not being offered for

    EAGLE but this doesn't mean it will be implemented in the future. We

    have been able to experienced volume license from other Autodesk

    products, they are quite simple to use and manage.  If you are

    interested on upgrading, please contact lourdes.vasquez@autodesk.com to

    provide you upgrade pricing options.

     

    Best Regards,

    Ed

    edwin.robledo@autodesk.com

     

    On 01/19/2017 06:17 AM, Friedrich Bleikamp wrote:

    Am 19.01.2017 um 09:19 schrieb Tilmann Reh:

    Matt Berggren schrieb:

     

    Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription

    OK, so EAGLE is dead. At least for me.

     

    You might however consider offering two alternative licensing models:

    one as a subscription, and one for buying. (The latter should work as

    before: you get a key, you own the software.)

     

    Tilmann

     

     

    As a company with a ten user license, we will probably stay at

    CadSoft Eagle V6.6. The new licensing policy is not acceptable.

     

    Friedrich

    -----------------------------------------------

    ... use NNTP://news.cadsoft.de and a

    functional news reader like Thunderbird!

    ... or http://www.eaglecentral.ca

    browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.

     

     

     

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  • rachaelp
    rachaelp over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Markus Rudolf wrote on Thu, 19 January 2017 14:38

    It can be implemented both. Installer asks for licensekey/installcode,

     

    if it gets one, everything works as before.

     

    If not, work as Viewer with a login option to activate the subscribable

     

    features.

     

    I don't see why this should not be possible to combine both worlds.

     

    Markus

     

     

    It's definitely possible, but whether they will entertain having two

    separate licensing systems within the software is another thing entirely.

    It might lead to unforeseen issues.

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • rachaelp
    rachaelp over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Markus Rudolf wrote on Thu, 19 January 2017 14:40

    On 19.01.2017 14:54, rachaelp wrote:

    Yes that's a valid point but I think Nokia and Blackberry were in

    a completely different situation to Autodesk.

     

    That doesn't matter. Fact is: it could happen. The remote possibility

    is

    enough.

     

    Markus

     

     

    Lots of bad things could happen in life, some with very small probability.

    If we worried about every single remote possibility of something going

    wrong we would have very restrictive lives with all the precautions we'd be

    having to take to avoid every remote possibility of danger. Life is too

    short to worry about this sort of thing too much.

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    Rachael schrieb:

     

    It's definitely possible, but whether they will entertain having two

    separate licensing systems within the software is another thing entirely.

    It might lead to unforeseen issues.

     

    Not supporting that might also lead to issues - foreseen, however: many

    people won't subscribe and move on to other software.

     

    It doesn't make any sense to try to force users into a subscription

    model if they don't want that. In fact, I would rather switch to a

    completely different CAD than "upgrade" to a subscription license.

     

    It's all that easy: if there are no permanent offline licenses any more,

    many will leave - or simply continue to use their existing licenses.

    It's up to Autodesk to judge if that counts for them (and/or if

    eventually new customers who subscribe are able to compensate for that).

     

    Tilmann

     

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  • techsupport
    techsupport over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    On 01/19/2017 09:18 AM, Markus Rudolf wrote:

    On 19.01.2017 11:58, Joop wrote:

    The old license system has been working fine for many years. There's

    absolutely NO REASON

    to change that. Anti-piracy motives are a joke. We will see how fast a

    pirated & patched copy will

    appear on the internet/torrents.

    As usual, the need for internet connection will bother legitimate

    users but

    will not stop piracy.

     

    That is 100% my opinion as well.

     

    Hi Markus,

    With my limited exposure to the transition to Autodesk, piracy was not

    really a factor considered for implementing a subscription model into

    EAGLE.  As stated earlier, it was about making the product assessable,

    flexible and affordable.

    Best Regards,

    Ed

    Edwin.robledo@autodesk.com

     

     

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