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Autodesk EAGLE
EAGLE User Chat (English) Eagle v8 licensing...
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  • eagle
  • license
  • freeware
  • 8.0
Related

Eagle v8 licensing...

technolomaniac
technolomaniac over 8 years ago

Hi All --

 

Moving this to a separate thread so it doesn't get lost in the ether.  Here's my two cents on licensing and I'd love your feedback:

 

Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription and the EAGLE paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an account to retrieve your license entitlement.  Once you have this, you are good to go and the SW will run as expected.  If you lose your network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you to work offline for 14 days.  I know that some folks would prefer to never have to connect, but this is required to support a monthly subscription model that can be selectively enabled and disabled when you use the SW (so you only pay when you use it).  The total cost of ownership for those folks using it less than a few weeks a year will thus be substantially lower and still enables you to access the full software for less money.  <Insert revolt here>  image

 

WRT to "what happens if autodesk decides to one day just shut off the license server?" ...ok, sure, that's possible, but so is a reality TV star becoming President of the..cough...nevermind, bad example.

 

Point is, that's a pretty remote possibility (think: time travel and alien invasions) and it wouldn't benefit us *at all* to upset the users we just spent real money hoping to bring into autodesk and earn their business.  As the guy with both development and P&L for the product, I can tell you that it's counterintuitive and wouldn't benefit us at all.  We know this.  We make SW used by governments, movie studios, game developers, MEs, Civil Engineers, machinists, etc. and you can bet that shutting down a license server is not to our benefit in any of these categories.  To demonstrate this behavior in one category, without a path for user SW and data, calls into question ALL of our tools' viability under this model.  Not helpful.

 

Now...a question was raised about "but what if I drop my subscription and I want my data".  Awesome, the data is yours and lives on your machine.  And for SW that stores data in the cloud (we have some of these) we always provide a path to your data.  If this again fails with one product, it puts all of the others up for discussion.  Again, not helpful.  (Read:  strategy = doomed).

 

"So what about needing an entitlement for the freeware to open the data I created in another version (a *paid* version) and reading it?  What if I want access and I dont want the 14-day time out?"

 

So here's the deal...We can do better here.  So we will.  Here's my commitment to the group here for freeware that ensures you always have a license that you can fall back on without need of internet connection *except when you first install it* (which after all, you would have had to get it in the first place):  in version 8.1 or 8.0.1 or whathaveyou (let's call it 'a future release'), if you install the SW and authenticate once, we'll remove the timer req.  So what I'm saying another way is, the freeware will require you to login the first time to get your license, but if you log out beyond that, you're good.  You got your entitlement and you can use it freely without connection.

 

Caveat:  to install an update, you will need to login.  The update server (which issues the new version...e.g. 8.1 or 8.2. or 8.0.1, etc.) requires that you login and get the update, but beyond that, logout.  Thus if you want to go off-grid in a mountain cabin somewhere, get your license at Starbucks (blagh! I understand they have 'free' wifi, but no frappucinos!  ...that stuff is bad for you) then get your license and go on your merry way up to the snow drenched peaks.  When you hear from the other mountaineers or your local yodeler that a new version of EAGLE is available...download, login, get your license, get your 'decaf double-pump vanilla non-fat latte macchiato' and head back up the slopes.

 

Point being, we can do the freeware better.  So we will.

 

Hope this is clear.  Let us know if you have questions!

 

Best regards,

 

Matt Berggren

Director - Autodesk

@technolomaniac

hackaday.io/matt

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Top Replies

  • COMPACT
    COMPACT over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest +4
    Not to worry, it's back to the Drawing board for me.
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 8 years ago +3
    Hi Matt, When will the EAGLE Maker version (or another solution for hobbiests) be v8-ready? I see the subscription for 'EAGLE Standard' and 'EAGLE Premium' are now available on the website, but not EAGLE…
  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport +3
    Il 21/02/2017 22:54, Ed Robledo ha scritto: The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE. Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they were not done…
Parents
  • Joop14
    Joop14 over 8 years ago

    http://www.altium.com/eagle-switch/altium-designer/

     

    It was just a matter of time...

     

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

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  • rachaelp
    rachaelp over 8 years ago in reply to Joop14

    Joop14 wrote:

     

    http://www.altium.com/eagle-switch/altium-designer/

     

    It was just a matter of time...

     

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

     

    I have to think that not many EAGLE users would be in a position to take up that offer. Even with the 40% off its going to be over $5000 and that only comes with one year of support and updates. After the first year you'd need to pay another $1500/year for a maintenance contract for support and updates. If you don't keep up on maintenance payments you'd likely be stung for back payments if you ever did need to update so realistically, most professional users are going to want to take that option rather than risk getting stuck with a problem and having to find a lot of money to get back onto maintenance in a hurry.

     

    The people who will go for this would be those who were considering it anyway because they regularly do high end boards and the additional features of Altium would be a benefit but the full price was too much for them to swallow. For the majority of smaller companies the cost of Altium and the ongoing support cost is still likely too much. Yes Altium has some really nice features but EAGLE's really easy to use and can do moderately complex boards quickly and easy enough such that the step up to Altium isn't justified by the cost. If EAGLE adds better routing features then this need even for high end boards may be reduced.

     

    So for the $500/year for an EAGLE Premium subscription, I could buy this for at least 10 years for the equivalent of the promotional price of Altium and for that I get 10 years of support. If I factor in the cost of maintenance I could have 4 EAGLE seats for the same price as 1 Altium seat in that 10 year period. Now, I know there is an issue with no perpetual license but in one of Matt Berggrens posts he stated that they would give an equivalent v7 license to fall back on with v8 subscriptions and a promise to ensure that a design could always be saved in a completely v7 compliant format so we then have a way to use EAGLE perpetually (See here: https://www.element14.com/community/thread/58485/l/eagle-license-recommendat-ion)

     

    Best Regards,

     

    Rachael

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  • chris60601
    chris60601 over 8 years ago in reply to Jan Cumps

    As I posted on another forum....

     

    Consider this; what if AutoDesk "could" make the 7.7.0 version open to the community for support and development. A fork if you will.

    Find a happy medium for project size and layers, keep the Eagle Cad stamp on the application, keep licensing open and be done with it.

    As this version develops, AutoDesk could take features from this public version and incorporate into the licensed version. This could allow further development expansion for AD and allow further communication with the greater community by showing them that they have "skin in the game".

    In the end, this could sway the hard-line "perpetuals" to adopt the newer versions put out by AD.

     

    For folks or companies that want a "fuller" and supported version; they would pay for the AutoDesk stamped version along with the yearly "maintenance fee".

     

    Thoughts?

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  • Joop14
    Joop14 over 8 years ago in reply to chris60601

    Chris Silva wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:52

    Too bad Eagle Cad wasnt Open Source or maybe AutoDesk "could" make the

    7.7.0 version open to the community for support and development. A fork

    if you will. Find a happy medium for size and layers and be done with it.

    Folks or companies that want the full version would simply pay for 8x and

    above.

     

     

    The price isn't the problem. The subscription is the problem.

    They don't even let you buy a license for the old V7 or V6 anymore.

     

     

     

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

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  • geralds
    geralds over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    Hi Rachael,

     

    Are you a pensioner? A lady or man?

     

    Because i saw that you here every time and you everywhere posts here.

    (since nov2015 nearly 25000 posts) and you'll staying at Eagle 7.7.0 and waits

    that Autodesk do something likely for you....

     

    Best Regards,

    Gerald

    ---

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  • rachaelp
    rachaelp over 8 years ago in reply to geralds

    Gerald Schwarz wrote:

     

    Hi Rachael,

     

    Are you a pensioner? A lady or man?

     

    Because i saw that you here every time and you everywhere posts here.

    (since nov2015 nearly 25000 posts) and you'll staying at Eagle 7.7.0 and waits

    that Autodesk do something likely for you....

     

    Best Regards,

    Gerald

    ---

    image

     

    Hi Gerald,

     

    I am a lady and no I am not a pensioner! image I work from my home office and have these forums up regularly to keep up with what's going on. I don't have nearly 25000 posts, I have nearly 25000 points on Element14. My actual number of posts is considerably less. I actually joined EAGLECentral before Element14 so my posts on there started in March 2015. To date I have 502 posts in the EAGLE forums (EAGLECentral and Element14 EAGLE forums both sync to the CADSoft NNTP servers so are effectively the same content) but more than that in total on Element 14 as I also post in other areas on there. Still, likely to be around 1000 posts total I suspect although I don't know how I can calculate an exact figure on there.

     

    Best Regards,

     

    Rachael

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  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    Are you a pensioner? A lady or man?

    I think you should change and keep him happy.

     

    What sort of question is that ...?

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  • geralds
    geralds over 8 years ago in reply to mcb1

    image https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11#Lunar_surface_operations

     

    Gerald

    ---

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  • mcb1
    mcb1 over 8 years ago in reply to geralds

    Sorry I'm failing to see a connection between you asking rachaelp a very strange question, and a moon landing.

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  • geralds
    geralds over 8 years ago in reply to mcb1

    "May the force be with you!"

     

    ---

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    On 2/23/2017 2:53 AM, Morten Leikvoll wrote:

    Let us know if there's anything  we can do for you.

     

    I could list a few, like comfort me, tell me why I should spend this

    money (or actually open the flow of money for an unknown period of time)

    when I already have v7. [The "already have v7 is important here] It will

    be a very expensive modular design block and soon obstacle avoidance

    (wich is cool, but not that important to me).

     

    Hey Morten,

     

    The reality is that it's your money, so don't feel like you have to part

    ways with it now if you are not fully convinced that it is going to be

    worth it.

     

    I see that so far the new features still aren't enough for you and

    that's cool. EAGLE's pace of development has increased greatly and it's

    not going to take a long time to get the features that have been

    promised in.

     

    Like I mentioned on the Autodesk Forums, it is now up to us to earn the

    business of our customers by improving EAGLE and adding features that

    will compel you to go subscription. That is our goal, and for whatever

    it's worth, despite the licensing change, I see EAGLE finally growing

    and getting the development that it has long deserved.

     

    The next few months are going to be interesting, and since you'll be

    checking in you'll be seeing it.

     

    Hang tight and as always let me know if there's anything else I can do

    for you.

     

    Best Regards,

    Jorge Garcia

     

     

     

    --

    We have a new forum here <http://forums.autodesk.com>

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    Am 22.02.2017 um 12:50 schrieb rachaelp:

    I'm sure Autodesk has plenty of servers spread around the world

     

    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/03/01/aws_s3_outage/ :

     

    Tuesday's Amazon Web Services mega-outage knocked offline not only websites big and small, by yanking away their backend storage,

    , Autodesk's cloud,  

     

    But hey, it was only five hours.  And maybe you couldn't use Eagle

    anyway then because you have a Razer mouse:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/razer/comments/5wpk3l/cant_connect_to_razer_synapse/

     

     

    (Thanks to fefe! https://blog.fefe.de/?ts=a64851a1 )

     

    Hans

     

     

     

     

     

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Reply
  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to rachaelp

    Am 22.02.2017 um 12:50 schrieb rachaelp:

    I'm sure Autodesk has plenty of servers spread around the world

     

    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/03/01/aws_s3_outage/ :

     

    Tuesday's Amazon Web Services mega-outage knocked offline not only websites big and small, by yanking away their backend storage,

    , Autodesk's cloud,  

     

    But hey, it was only five hours.  And maybe you couldn't use Eagle

    anyway then because you have a Razer mouse:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/razer/comments/5wpk3l/cant_connect_to_razer_synapse/

     

     

    (Thanks to fefe! https://blog.fefe.de/?ts=a64851a1 )

     

    Hans

     

     

     

     

     

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Children
  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Yep, so true. And freezing for 5 hours because the nest thermostat also

    didn't control the heater anymore....

     

    Interesting times nowadays...

     

    Markus

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Markus Rudolf wrote on Thu, 02 March 2017 01:33

    Yep, so true. And freezing for 5 hours because the nest thermostat also

    didn't control the heater anymore....

     

    Interesting times nowadays...

     

    I'm starting to wonder if I'm part Luddite.  I have a swamp cooler on my

    house, I drive a 1988 Toyota 4x4 with a manual transmission, and I've taken

    my best photographs with a completely manual Nikkormat.

     

    On the other hand, I'm having solar panels installed, I've got a Raspberry

    Pi controlling the watering system and I love my Lumia 550XL...  LOL!

    --

    EAGLE support forums at http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: Where the EAGLE community meets.

     

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