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EAGLE User Chat (English) Eagle v8 licensing...
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  • eagle
  • license
  • freeware
  • 8.0
Related

Eagle v8 licensing...

technolomaniac
technolomaniac over 8 years ago

Hi All --

 

Moving this to a separate thread so it doesn't get lost in the ether.  Here's my two cents on licensing and I'd love your feedback:

 

Firstly, the Autodesk licensing model is subscription and the EAGLE paid license will require that you install the SW and then generate an account to retrieve your license entitlement.  Once you have this, you are good to go and the SW will run as expected.  If you lose your network connection, the SW has a 14-day heartbeat that will enable you to work offline for 14 days.  I know that some folks would prefer to never have to connect, but this is required to support a monthly subscription model that can be selectively enabled and disabled when you use the SW (so you only pay when you use it).  The total cost of ownership for those folks using it less than a few weeks a year will thus be substantially lower and still enables you to access the full software for less money.  <Insert revolt here>  image

 

WRT to "what happens if autodesk decides to one day just shut off the license server?" ...ok, sure, that's possible, but so is a reality TV star becoming President of the..cough...nevermind, bad example.

 

Point is, that's a pretty remote possibility (think: time travel and alien invasions) and it wouldn't benefit us *at all* to upset the users we just spent real money hoping to bring into autodesk and earn their business.  As the guy with both development and P&L for the product, I can tell you that it's counterintuitive and wouldn't benefit us at all.  We know this.  We make SW used by governments, movie studios, game developers, MEs, Civil Engineers, machinists, etc. and you can bet that shutting down a license server is not to our benefit in any of these categories.  To demonstrate this behavior in one category, without a path for user SW and data, calls into question ALL of our tools' viability under this model.  Not helpful.

 

Now...a question was raised about "but what if I drop my subscription and I want my data".  Awesome, the data is yours and lives on your machine.  And for SW that stores data in the cloud (we have some of these) we always provide a path to your data.  If this again fails with one product, it puts all of the others up for discussion.  Again, not helpful.  (Read:  strategy = doomed).

 

"So what about needing an entitlement for the freeware to open the data I created in another version (a *paid* version) and reading it?  What if I want access and I dont want the 14-day time out?"

 

So here's the deal...We can do better here.  So we will.  Here's my commitment to the group here for freeware that ensures you always have a license that you can fall back on without need of internet connection *except when you first install it* (which after all, you would have had to get it in the first place):  in version 8.1 or 8.0.1 or whathaveyou (let's call it 'a future release'), if you install the SW and authenticate once, we'll remove the timer req.  So what I'm saying another way is, the freeware will require you to login the first time to get your license, but if you log out beyond that, you're good.  You got your entitlement and you can use it freely without connection.

 

Caveat:  to install an update, you will need to login.  The update server (which issues the new version...e.g. 8.1 or 8.2. or 8.0.1, etc.) requires that you login and get the update, but beyond that, logout.  Thus if you want to go off-grid in a mountain cabin somewhere, get your license at Starbucks (blagh! I understand they have 'free' wifi, but no frappucinos!  ...that stuff is bad for you) then get your license and go on your merry way up to the snow drenched peaks.  When you hear from the other mountaineers or your local yodeler that a new version of EAGLE is available...download, login, get your license, get your 'decaf double-pump vanilla non-fat latte macchiato' and head back up the slopes.

 

Point being, we can do the freeware better.  So we will.

 

Hope this is clear.  Let us know if you have questions!

 

Best regards,

 

Matt Berggren

Director - Autodesk

@technolomaniac

hackaday.io/matt

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Top Replies

  • COMPACT
    COMPACT over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest +4
    Not to worry, it's back to the Drawing board for me.
  • shabaz
    shabaz over 8 years ago +3
    Hi Matt, When will the EAGLE Maker version (or another solution for hobbiests) be v8-ready? I see the subscription for 'EAGLE Standard' and 'EAGLE Premium' are now available on the website, but not EAGLE…
  • albertovignati
    albertovignati over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport +3
    Il 21/02/2017 22:54, Ed Robledo ha scritto: The customers are the sole driving force to the improvements to EAGLE. Some of these 'wants' take time to be done right, that's the reason they were not done…
  • sauerwald
    sauerwald over 8 years ago

    Matt


    I purchased the full commercial licence for Eagle last month.  My understanding is that if I want to upgrade, I need to convert to the subscription model, and I have essentially lost the investment that I made in purchasing a license.

     

    Mark Sauerwald

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  • e14candies
    e14candies over 8 years ago in reply to sauerwald

     

    from a few posts not too long ago....

     

    Autodesk acquires 'EAGLE': Official Q&A Discussion, New Website & What This

    Means!

    jwatson Employee Jul 20, 2016 10:57

    OFFICIAL NEWS from Matt Berggren, Director  Autodesk Circuits / Tinkercad /

    123D and now...EAGLE!

    Hello EAGLE users one and all!

     

    Will there still be a free version?

     

    Absolutely yes. We have no plans to eliminate the free tier at all.  This

    is central to EAGLE's success and aligns with how Autodesk does business

    today.  We'll continue this license to ensure everyone has access to

    powerful, easy to use schematic and PCB software.

     

     

    How does this affect upgrades?

     

    Upgrades work as they had in the past, for the most part.  If you want to

    upgrade from v6 Layout + Schematic to v7 Layout + Schematic, then you pay

    33% of the license price.  Simple.

     

    If you want to upgrade from v6 Layout + Schematic to v7 Layout + Schematic

    + Autorouter, then you first pay the upgrade cost of 33% to v7 Layout +

    Schematic and finally, you pay the difference in cost between the two v7

    license types.  Same as before.

     

    What's different?  For a limited time, we've reduced the price to upgrade

    legacy v5 licenses of EAGLE from 66% to 33% of the license price.  So if

    you've got a version 5 license, rather than paying 66% of the new license

    cost to upgrade, do it now for only 33%!

     

     

     

    Will I be required to pay 'maintenance'?

     

    Simply put, no.

     

     

     

    You should see some improvements in the pricing starting next week. The

    site has given some incorrect prices as of late so we should these

    issues addressed very soon.

     

    I'd say check the pricing next week, I think you'll be pleasantly

    surprised.

     

    Best Regards,

    Jorge Garcia

     

     

     

     

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to techsupport

    On 19.01.2017 16:55, Ed wrote:

     

    Hi Markus,

    I have been blessed to be part of the EAGLE support team for a very long

    time. I am confident to state that we would get anywhere between 20 to

    40 request of existing users asking to get access to their license

    because they have misplaced their key or no longer have their

    installation code. Every time we had an update, the request might reach

    hundreds every day. Many voiced frustration because they intended to

    work during the weekend but couldn't validate their registration.

     

    Yeah well you can charge them fees for looking up their code if they

    messed it up. Would be fair enough.

     

    Nice extra revenue image

     

    I never lost any code in the last 15 years and don't plan to do so.

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to technolomaniac

    Matt Berggren schrieb:

    No they want a constant cash flow. "Pay" would imply you own the

    software afterwards, they want to rent it to you.

     

    The major difference being that if you dont like what we release in a

    subsequent point-release (8.1, 8.2, 8.3...) you have not paid for

    everything up front, hoping one day they add better routing or better

    hierarchy, or better connectivity tools or design rules, etc. and

    then beeb disappointed that you "bet" it would come in version x.y

    only to find that it didnt.

     

     

    Now you are completely inverting the facts.

     

    With a paid license, you get exactly what you pay for. You might even

    check out the freeware before to see if any new functions or changes

    justify the expenses. If you want to further use the old version

    (without additional cost, BTW), you simply don't update.

     

    With a subscription, you continuously pay even without any update (if

    it's really possible to avoid updates without losing the activation).

    Then you are disappointed!

     

    Tilmann

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to technolomaniac

    On 19.01.2017 16:56, Matt Berggren wrote:

     

    The major difference being that if you dont like what we release in a subsequent point-release (8.1, 8.2, 8.3...) you have not paid for everything up front, hoping one day they add better routing or better hierarchy, or better connectivity tools or design rules, etc. and then beeb disappointed that you "bet" it would come in version x.y only to find that it didnt.

     

    In the previous model you at least had the option on staying

    disappointed because if you decide to not put in any more money in the

    slot machine, you still had a full functional version which you could

    reinstall whenever needed without any hazzle.

     

    Markus

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Markus Rudolf wrote on Thu, 19 January 2017 16:48

    On 19.01.2017 16:55, Ed wrote:

     

    Hi Markus,

    I have been blessed to be part of the EAGLE support team for a

    very long

    time. I am confident to state that we would get anywhere between

    20 to

    40 request of existing users asking to get access to their

    license

    because they have misplaced their key or no longer have their

    installation code. Every time we had an update, the request might

    reach

    hundreds every day. Many voiced frustration because they intended

    to

    work during the weekend but couldn't validate their registration.

     

    Yeah well you can charge them fees for looking up their code if they

    messed it up. Would be fair enough.

     

    Nice extra revenue image

     

    I never lost any code in the last 15 years and don't plan to do so.

     

     

    Nor have I as a user.

     

    As a distributor I started a policy about 2 years ago to charge $25 to

    replace lost licenses, it was very clear in the email sent out with license

    info.  After that, no one complained and I only had one customer who needed

    to use it--and he apologized for the extra work he caused us.

     

    Cheers,

     

    James.

     

    --

    James Morrison  ~~~  Stratford Digital

    http://www.stratforddigital.ca

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • Justynb
    Justynb over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Markus Rudolf wrote on Thu, 19 January 2017 11:48

    On 19.01.2017 16:55, Ed wrote:

     

    Hi Markus,

    I have been blessed to be part of the EAGLE support team for a

    very long

    time. I am confident to state that we would get anywhere between

    20 to

    40 request of existing users asking to get access to their

    license

    because they have misplaced their key or no longer have their

    installation code. Every time we had an update, the request might

    reach

    hundreds every day. Many voiced frustration because they intended

    to

    work during the weekend but couldn't validate their registration.

     

    Yeah well you can charge them fees for looking up their code if they

    messed it up. Would be fair enough.

     

    Nice extra revenue image

     

    I never lost any code in the last 15 years and don't plan to do so.

     

     

    Alternatively since every purchaser from now on is inevitably going to need

    an Autodesk account, just a link to download their key from their account

    page on the site. Then it is up to them whether they keep it safe or not.

     

    Sounds like a pretty simple solution to me.

    --

    http://www.eaglecentral.ca :: The original and best browser access to CadSoft EAGLE support forums.  Supported by EAGLE licenses purchased through us :: http://www.eaglelicenses.com

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

     

    So Eagle is going to the subscription model. Didn't you learn anything

    from the previous licensing fiasco?

     

    You can count me and my company out. I will not rent any software,

    especially not business critical software like this.

     

    Does anyone happen know a good KiCad tutorial aimed for Eagle users?

     

    Hi Jussi,

     

    I find it interesting the mention of KiCAD and business critical in the

    same post.

     

    With an open source tool like KiCAD you are accepting the software as

    is, there is no promise of prompt support or any professional assistance

    should you run into problems. You also have no expectation of feature

    implementations or a constant development cycle. I'm not knocking it's

    capabilities, simply the fact that using it entails risk just like any

    other program.

     

    If I had a business, I don't think I would be comfortable with that. I

    would want to know that if I have a question or problem there is someone

    I can reach out to and get a quick response.

     

    I would encourage everyone who sees subscription and says "I'm out" to

    give it a try and then form an opinion, right now most of these posts

    just seem to be reactionary.

     

    Hope this helps,

    Jorge Garcia

     

     

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  • autodeskguest
    autodeskguest over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    On 19.01.2017 18:06, Jorge Garcia wrote:

     

    I find it interesting the mention of KiCAD and business critical in the

    same post.

     

    If CERN uses it, i'd tend to say it's most likely good enough.

     

     

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  • sauerwald
    sauerwald over 8 years ago in reply to autodeskguest

    Jorge

     

    I would agree with you that for business use, there is value in having a professional support team who continue to update the software and provide technical support.   This is why I paid the fee to upgrade my Eagle license to a full, commercial license less than a month ago.

     

    I would be willing to pay a fee for support, and I am happy to pay for upgrades,  but not for use of the software, this is why I paid to purchase the full commercial license for Eagle last month. 

     

    When you tie the use of my designs to paying a fee to access them, you raise a barrier that I am not willing to cross.   I will be looking at continuing to use Eagle version 7, until I am forced to move to another CAD environment in which I will have perpetual, free access to my designs.

     

    Mark

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